(08-31-2018 11:50 AM)SMUleopold Wrote:  I will be happy to explain.

Houston is the most relevant G5 school in the nation because it is Houston that has shown, both currently and for multiple generations, that they belong among the big boys of college athletics, in all sports, and yet have find themselves in the no-mans-land of G5 status. They aren't upstarts or never was's, they have been there and done that and continue to do it even while I'm typing this. Houston is the reminder to every P5 school that just because you have a history with a major conference you aren't guaranteed anything in the future.

I'm not going to take anything away from any other G5 school, and certainly not USF, or UCF, or, for that matter, BYU or Boise State, but Houston has competed for national championships regularly in football, baseball, basketball, track, and others before many on this board were born. USF, UCF, and Boise have competed for 20 years. BYU has done it for almost 40 now. Houston was competing and beating Auburn in bowls in the '50's. They have NBA, NFL, and MLB hall-of-famers, and Heisman trophy winners as alumni, Final fours, and every possible conceivable honors college and professional athletics have to offer, along with the Olympian of the 20th century in Carl Lewis as an alum standing, looking over their shoulders, back at the P5 saying "What have you accomplished?" AND they have the best player in college football this year, per multiple sources. MOST P5 PROGRAMS can't equal that combination, and - I'm sorry - with all due respect USF can't yet, either.

Why is this important? Because it hits at the heart of the 'they can't compete-they don't belong-they're upstarts who have to prove themselves' argument. You can't say that Houston is a flash-in-the-pan, something that USF and UCF still have to shake, fairly or not. You can't say that they are upstarts and have to prove something to 90% of the P5. You can't say that they don't have facilities, or money, or tradition, or relevance - not when they called the Astrodome home, or won the Cotton Bowl over a Tom Osborne coached Nebraska team almost 40 years ago (amongst others), or haven't contributed to the very nature of college football with Bill Yeoman's innovations - you can look those up. You can't say it's just because they got lucky with a coach - not when the Big XII has become reliant on them to provide them with winners.

Christ, even Barry Switzer has advocated to keep Houston out of the Big XII because they would hog all the Houston recruits. IF THEY ARE SCARED OF YOU THEN YOU ARE RELEVANT.

Houston had to fight for a team, fight their way into the SWC, fight their way into bowls (something tells me the Bluebonnet Bowl was created for them to have a chance, like the Fiesta was for Arizona State), and now they have to fight for respect despite consistently beating teams from every major conference since WW II. You can't make the argument that Houston has to prove themselves and if any one school has the right to ***** and complain about realignment it's probably - probably - Houston.

If there is one question I'd like to ask the P5 it would be "What did Houston do to kicked to the curb?" I understand why the majority of the programs found themselves on the outside looking in. I understand even why my own alma does - we, arguably, blew our chances by getting caught cheating.

But Houston didn't get caught (notice I say 'caught') and managed to perform for decades, and since they have both a current successful program and the history to back it up, they are the most relevant. So who did the Cougars piss off? What - low attendance? My god, if that gets you kicked to the curb there's a few more programs I'd like to see cut.

If USF, or UCF, or UConn, or Boise State can continue to compete for 70 years in ALL sports then you they will have the right to call themselves the most relevant.

E-mail me when that happens.

So basically, your entire long winded argument is “they’ve been around longer!”. And basketball is irrelevant. If playing for titles in basketball mattered to football, then UCONN and Villanova would be power house relevant FBS programs.

By your logic, Iowa State is a relevant Big 12 team since they’ve been playing football since the early 1900s.

(08-31-2018 12:22 PM)The Knight Time Wrote:  So basically, your entire long winded argument is “they’ve been around longer!”. And basketball is irrelevant. If playing for titles in basketball mattered to football, then UCONN and Villanova would be power house relevant FBS programs.

By your logic, Iowa State is a relevant Big 12 team since they’ve been playing football since the early 1900s.

he did mention competitiveness in his argument

i think his point is you win for a long time its harder to brush you off as a flash in the pan

Well gosh!, all this great stuff coming from an SMU fan no less, my cup runith over
There are many g5 teams spending loads of money on sports and it’s gonna create PR problems for the a5 in the near future

(08-31-2018 12:22 PM)The Knight Time Wrote:  So basically, your entire long winded argument is “they’ve been around longer!”. And basketball is irrelevant. If playing for titles in basketball mattered to football, then UCONN and Villanova would be power house relevant FBS programs.

By your logic, Iowa State is a relevant Big 12 team since they’ve been playing football since the early 1900s.

No. Go back and actually read it.

My argument is that they have been winning for as long as Iowa State has been around. BIG difference.

What that does is DESTROY any metric that can be used to discount them as a major program, sans actual inclusion.

And the basketball, baseball, and Olympic sports angle was just to cover my as$.

(08-31-2018 11:47 AM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:39 AM)otown Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:32 AM)KnightNasty Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:00 AM)usffan Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 10:56 AM)ArmoredUpKnight Wrote:  I read it as UH expect to go to a NY6 Bowl game every year.

The expectations are high, year in and year out.

No argument that they have high expectations, but "the most relevant non-Power 5 school in the nation" is a pretty ridiculous claim.

USFFan

If they're talking about brand... Boise State is still king. I think UCF has moved into the #2 slot but Houston is indeed very relevant and probably #3.

If UCF makes it to the CFP undefeated, or even just another NY6...... they will have accomplished everything BSU has done, but in a much more attractive location.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RZ_Xz7LE-I

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoUIw32z10s

Yes, I am sure there are beautiful promotional tourist videos for Duluth Minnesota too. Doesn't change the fact that UCF is in a very attractive location college football. Also, that West Colonial Video was funny

(08-31-2018 12:43 PM)otown Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:47 AM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:39 AM)otown Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:32 AM)KnightNasty Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:00 AM)usffan Wrote:  No argument that they have high expectations, but "the most relevant non-Power 5 school in the nation" is a pretty ridiculous claim.

USFFan

If they're talking about brand... Boise State is still king. I think UCF has moved into the #2 slot but Houston is indeed very relevant and probably #3.

If UCF makes it to the CFP undefeated, or even just another NY6...... they will have accomplished everything BSU has done, but in a much more attractive location.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RZ_Xz7LE-I

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoUIw32z10s

Yes, I am sure there are beautiful promotional tourist videos for Duluth Minnesota too. Doesn't change the fact that UCF is in a very attractive location college football. Also, that West Colonial Video was funny

It was a choice between Orange Blossom Trail or Colonial Drive.

(08-31-2018 11:39 AM)otown Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:32 AM)KnightNasty Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:00 AM)usffan Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 10:56 AM)ArmoredUpKnight Wrote:  I read it as UH expect to go to a NY6 Bowl game every year.

The expectations are high, year in and year out.

No argument that they have high expectations, but "the most relevant non-Power 5 school in the nation" is a pretty ridiculous claim.

USFFan

If they're talking about brand... Boise State is still king. I think UCF has moved into the #2 slot but Houston is indeed very relevant and probably #3.

If UCF makes it to the CFP undefeated, or even just another NY6...... they will have accomplished everything BSU has done, but in a much more attractive location.

Lets pump the brakes. Yea it will mean we have as many major bowl appearances. But lets not pretend we have been as dominant as them. We have had plenty of lows to go with our highs. Lets review the last 2 decades

Boise St
11-3
10-3
9-4
12-2
8-5
11-2
12-1
12-1
14-0
12-1
10-3
13-0
9-4
11-1
13-1
12-1
8-4
10-2
10-2
6-5
213-45

UCF
13-0
6-7
0-12
9-4
12-1
10-4
5-7
11-3
8-5
4-8
10-4
4-8
8-5
0-11
3-9
7-5
6-5
7-4
4-7
9-2
136-111

They have sustained winning long term and won 10+ games a season all but 5 times in the last 20 years. That is why they get the respect from the media.

(08-31-2018 11:32 AM)KnightNasty Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:00 AM)usffan Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 10:56 AM)ArmoredUpKnight Wrote:  I read it as UH expect to go to a NY6 Bowl game every year.

The expectations are high, year in and year out.

No argument that they have high expectations, but "the most relevant non-Power 5 school in the nation" is a pretty ridiculous claim.

USFFan

If they're talking about brand... Boise State is still king. I think UCF has moved into the #2 slot but Houston is indeed very relevant and probably #3.

Memphis is gonna throttle Houston again this year, so the Tigers should climb to no. 3. And I also think it's reasonable for Memphis to claim the no. 2 spot after this upcoming season's two wins over UCF

It’s just one persons opinion.. he/she was hyping up the season in a Houston paper.

Pretty sure other schools have bold predictions and hype pieces.

There’s not really a metric for “most relevant”... so I wouldn’t make that claim. I’d say we’re relevant and could have a great year. But who knows we also could be off to a 1-3 start if things don’t go our way.

(08-31-2018 01:45 PM)cotton1991 Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:32 AM)KnightNasty Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:00 AM)usffan Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 10:56 AM)ArmoredUpKnight Wrote:  I read it as UH expect to go to a NY6 Bowl game every year.

The expectations are high, year in and year out.

No argument that they have high expectations, but "the most relevant non-Power 5 school in the nation" is a pretty ridiculous claim.

USFFan

If they're talking about brand... Boise State is still king. I think UCF has moved into the #2 slot but Houston is indeed very relevant and probably #3.

Memphis is gonna throttle Houston again this year, so the Tigers should climb to no. 3. And I also think it's reasonable for Memphis to claim the no. 2 spot after this upcoming season's two wins over UCF

Why do we have to default Boise as no.1? Do they get more TV views? No. Have a bigger stadium? No. Have been ranked higher than UH or UCF in their peak rankings ? I don’t think so I think both peaked at 6. Not P6 not as relevant

(08-31-2018 01:11 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 12:43 PM)otown Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:47 AM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:39 AM)otown Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:32 AM)KnightNasty Wrote:  If they're talking about brand... Boise State is still king. I think UCF has moved into the #2 slot but Houston is indeed very relevant and probably #3.

If UCF makes it to the CFP undefeated, or even just another NY6...... they will have accomplished everything BSU has done, but in a much more attractive location.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RZ_Xz7LE-I

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoUIw32z10s

Yes, I am sure there are beautiful promotional tourist videos for Duluth Minnesota too. Doesn't change the fact that UCF is in a very attractive location college football. Also, that West Colonial Video was funny

It was a choice between Orange Blossom Trail or Colonial Drive.

I guess with obt we’d have seen more hookers. Having lived in both places, and on the west coast currently; I have to say it’s frustrating how little planning and zoning is done in Florida. It seems like wherever they feel like putting something they just plop it down.

(08-31-2018 01:39 PM)MagicKnightmare Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:39 AM)otown Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:32 AM)KnightNasty Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:00 AM)usffan Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 10:56 AM)ArmoredUpKnight Wrote:  I read it as UH expect to go to a NY6 Bowl game every year.

The expectations are high, year in and year out.

No argument that they have high expectations, but "the most relevant non-Power 5 school in the nation" is a pretty ridiculous claim.

USFFan

If they're talking about brand... Boise State is still king. I think UCF has moved into the #2 slot but Houston is indeed very relevant and probably #3.

If UCF makes it to the CFP undefeated, or even just another NY6...... they will have accomplished everything BSU has done, but in a much more attractive location.

Lets pump the brakes. Yea it will mean we have as many major bowl appearances. But lets not pretend we have been as dominant as them. We have had plenty of lows to go with our highs. Lets review the last 2 decades

Boise St
11-3
10-3
9-4
12-2
8-5
11-2
12-1
12-1
14-0
12-1
10-3
13-0
9-4
11-1
13-1
12-1
8-4
10-2
10-2
6-5
213-45

UCF
13-0
6-7
0-12
9-4
12-1
10-4
5-7
11-3
8-5
4-8
10-4
4-8
8-5
0-11
3-9
7-5
6-5
7-4
4-7
9-2
136-111

They have sustained winning long term and won 10+ games a season all but 5 times in the last 20 years. That is why they get the respect from the media.

I didn't say anything of the sort. I'm talking about brand power and perception of the program...

(08-31-2018 02:19 PM)KnightNasty Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 01:39 PM)MagicKnightmare Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:39 AM)otown Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:32 AM)KnightNasty Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:00 AM)usffan Wrote:  No argument that they have high expectations, but "the most relevant non-Power 5 school in the nation" is a pretty ridiculous claim.

USFFan

If they're talking about brand... Boise State is still king. I think UCF has moved into the #2 slot but Houston is indeed very relevant and probably #3.

If UCF makes it to the CFP undefeated, or even just another NY6...... they will have accomplished everything BSU has done, but in a much more attractive location.

Lets pump the brakes. Yea it will mean we have as many major bowl appearances. But lets not pretend we have been as dominant as them. We have had plenty of lows to go with our highs. Lets review the last 2 decades

Boise St
11-3
10-3
9-4
12-2
8-5
11-2
12-1
12-1
14-0
12-1
10-3
13-0
9-4
11-1
13-1
12-1
8-4
10-2
10-2
6-5
213-45

UCF
13-0
6-7
0-12
9-4
12-1
10-4
5-7
11-3
8-5
4-8
10-4
4-8
8-5
0-11
3-9
7-5
6-5
7-4
4-7
9-2
136-111

They have sustained winning long term and won 10+ games a season all but 5 times in the last 20 years. That is why they get the respect from the media.

I didn't say anything of the sort. I'm talking about brand power and perception of the program...

And the reason they have that brand power and perception is they have lost 45 games in 20 years. FYI, we've lost 40 since joining the American. We are second in perception and brand power, but its a firm second. They have literally decades of sustained success. We've only strung together 10 wins in back to back seasons once ever. They did it for 7 straight years. People have short term memories, but brand power is because of the long term success. If we falter this year and next, all that brand momentum we have will be destroyed.

(08-31-2018 02:28 PM)MagicKnightmare Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 02:19 PM)KnightNasty Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 01:39 PM)MagicKnightmare Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:39 AM)otown Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:32 AM)KnightNasty Wrote:  If they're talking about brand... Boise State is still king. I think UCF has moved into the #2 slot but Houston is indeed very relevant and probably #3.

If UCF makes it to the CFP undefeated, or even just another NY6...... they will have accomplished everything BSU has done, but in a much more attractive location.

Lets pump the brakes. Yea it will mean we have as many major bowl appearances. But lets not pretend we have been as dominant as them. We have had plenty of lows to go with our highs. Lets review the last 2 decades

Boise St
11-3
10-3
9-4
12-2
8-5
11-2
12-1
12-1
14-0
12-1
10-3
13-0
9-4
11-1
13-1
12-1
8-4
10-2
10-2
6-5
213-45

UCF
13-0
6-7
0-12
9-4
12-1
10-4
5-7
11-3
8-5
4-8
10-4
4-8
8-5
0-11
3-9
7-5
6-5
7-4
4-7
9-2
136-111

They have sustained winning long term and won 10+ games a season all but 5 times in the last 20 years. That is why they get the respect from the media.

I didn't say anything of the sort. I'm talking about brand power and perception of the program...

And the reason they have that brand power and perception is they have lost 45 games in 20 years. FYI, we've lost 40 since joining the American. We are second in perception and brand power, but its a firm second. They have literally decades of sustained success. We've only strung together 10 wins in back to back seasons once ever. They did it for 7 straight years. People have short term memories, but brand power is because of the long term success. If we falter this year and next, all that brand momentum we have will be destroyed.

Their brand power and recognition has less to do with their WAC/MWC record and more about their 3 BCS/NY6 bowls that they won. You dont put them in any of those bowls and the public thinks that they are garbage.

“Firm Second in perception and brand”

Not counting navy (army/navy game) no g5 comes even remotely close to Houston in number of highly rated games.... The 3 highest rated games in C-usa history involved Houston.. the highest rated game in AAC history involves Houston..

UCF is coming off an undefeated season, and exciting offense with a hesiman candidate qb.. Houston was 7-5 with a dreadfully boring offense last season..
UCF has been picked for zero OTA games (fox/abc/NBC).. with a potential for 1 (USF/UCF)
Houston has been picked for 2 so far, with a potential for a 3rd (houston/Memphis)

Houston has had 2 sports illustrated covers in the last 5 years .. no other g5 has had 1

We are aware g5 conference titles has zero effect on relevancy

(08-31-2018 02:59 PM)pesik Wrote:  “Firm Second in perception and brand”

Not counting navy (army/navy game) no g5 comes even remotely close to Houston in number of highly rated games.... The 3 highest rated games in C-usa history involved Houston.. the highest rated game in AAC history involves Houston..

UCF is coming off an undefeated season, and exciting offense with a hesiman candidate qb.. Houston was 7-5 with a dreadfully boring offense last season..
UCF has been picked for zero OTA games (fox/abc/NBC).. with a potential for 1 (USF/UCF)
Houston has been picked for 2 so far, with a potential for a 3rd (houston/Memphis)

Houston has had 2 sports illustrated covers in the last 5 years .. no other g5 has had 1

We are aware g5 conference titles has zero effect on relevancy

UCONN has had 4 Sports Illustrated covers in the last 5 years and 10 covers in the last 10 years.

Talking football

"As the most relevant non-Power 5 school in the nation; the University of Houston may be a Group of 5 school - but it has Power 5 expectations."

Where exactly does that quote say "football only"...?

(08-31-2018 01:45 PM)cotton1991 Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:32 AM)KnightNasty Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 11:00 AM)usffan Wrote:  

(08-31-2018 10:56 AM)ArmoredUpKnight Wrote:  I read it as UH expect to go to a NY6 Bowl game every year.

The expectations are high, year in and year out.

No argument that they have high expectations, but "the most relevant non-Power 5 school in the nation" is a pretty ridiculous claim.

USFFan

If they're talking about brand... Boise State is still king. I think UCF has moved into the #2 slot but Houston is indeed very relevant and probably #3.

Memphis is gonna throttle Houston again this year, so the Tigers should climb to no. 3. And I also think it's reasonable for Memphis to claim the no. 2 spot after this upcoming season's two wins over UCF

boise is still king. if boise was in ucf's positon last year. im confident that media would have been more supportive of them. But who are we kidding the real rankings are 1.ECU
2 nobody

[/quote]

It's an opinion... one man's opinion from a local writer.

I would imagine it wouldn't be hard to find similar language from a Tampa, Orlando, Memphis, etc writer.....

I wouldn't get all twisted up if i did find that.
[/quote]

Our beat writer is infatuated by the actual versus announced attendance conspiracy.