(09-02-2018 02:36 PM)HuskyU Wrote:  Tulane with that MACtion attendance.

To be fair there was a Saints home game with the exact same kickoff time as ours. Preseason or not, this city flocks to Saints games, so while I would definitely have preferred higher attendance, I'm surprised it wasn't lower. We'll definitely see a bump for the next game even though it's an FCS team because they're located nearby and will bring more fans and turn out more of our fans.

FYI - this is the first time there's ever been a Tulane home game and a Saints home game on the same day. We shared a stadium from the Saints' founding until Yulman opened in 2014.

(09-03-2018 11:08 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 11:03 AM)I_LUV_MEMPHISTIGERS Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 10:48 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 10:37 AM)I_LUV_MEMPHISTIGERS Wrote:  

(09-02-2018 02:33 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  Perhaps you missed the article that everyone inflates announced attendance numbers over turnstile numbers. But, according to article by WSJ taking into account all data from last year, USF inflates them the LEAST out of all AAC teams not named Navy.

Regardless, we are all aware that the announced attendance number given is all tickets sold/distributed, not who actually attended the game. Thank you for the information, though.

I agree, and I'm not sure why, but The University of Memphis is currently in the opposite boat. We report turnstile attendance, not tickets sold. That doesn't necessarily make it any more accurate nor inflate our number. We reported 33k for our opening game, which grossfully deflated actual attendance.

Digital infrastructure and scanners at turn gates broke down at game time and thousands of non-counted attendees passed through the gates without ticket scans. We were 42-45k actual attendance, STRONG. A blind man could see that sitting in the stands.

Without Standardization, I don't even know what attendance even means.

No you don't. This had been debunked in the Wall Street Journal article, (and frankly several other articles). No one does this. The WSJ got their ticket numbers DIRECTLY FROM MEMPHIS THROUGH AN OPEN RECORDS REQUEST. So, if they were wrong, they would have been corrected prior to being sent in or an excuse given.

Thanks for playing.

coming
Argue with your own school who provided the actual attendance numbers, not me. Your beef is with them, not me.

The school is making a case for that.

You've never actually attended the Liberty Bowl, have you? You have have no frame of reference. I could send you pictures but they would be meaningless.

(09-03-2018 12:02 PM)rollgreenwave Wrote:  

(09-02-2018 02:36 PM)HuskyU Wrote:  Tulane with that MACtion attendance.

To be fair there was a Saints home game with the exact same kickoff time as ours. Preseason or not, this city flocks to Saints games, so while I would definitely have preferred higher attendance, I'm surprised it wasn't lower. We'll definitely see a bump for the next game even though it's an FCS team because they're located nearby and will bring more fans and turn out more of our fans.

FYI - this is the first time there's ever been a Tulane home game and a Saints home game on the same day. We shared a stadium from the Saints' founding until Yulman opened in 2014.

Ah ok. That makes sense. Last year when we had to play ECU on Sunday, it was the same time as the Pats and Giants games. Attendance was not good.

(09-03-2018 12:08 PM)I_LUV_MEMPHISTIGERS Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 11:08 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 11:03 AM)I_LUV_MEMPHISTIGERS Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 10:48 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 10:37 AM)I_LUV_MEMPHISTIGERS Wrote:  I agree, and I'm not sure why, but The University of Memphis is currently in the opposite boat. We report turnstile attendance, not tickets sold. That doesn't necessarily make it any more accurate nor inflate our number. We reported 33k for our opening game, which grossfully deflated actual attendance.

Digital infrastructure and scanners at turn gates broke down at game time and thousands of non-counted attendees passed through the gates without ticket scans. We were 42-45k actual attendance, STRONG. A blind man could see that sitting in the stands.

Without Standardization, I don't even know what attendance even means.

No you don't. This had been debunked in the Wall Street Journal article, (and frankly several other articles). No one does this. The WSJ got their ticket numbers DIRECTLY FROM MEMPHIS THROUGH AN OPEN RECORDS REQUEST. So, if they were wrong, they would have been corrected prior to being sent in or an excuse given.

Thanks for playing.

coming
Argue with your own school who provided the actual attendance numbers, not me. Your beef is with them, not me.

The school is making a case for that.

You've never actually attended the Liberty Bowl, have you? You have have no frame of reference. I could send you pictures but they would be meaningless.

OK, if the record is corrected by the school, then I stand corrected.

Joey Knight tweeted that there were 21,000 butts in RJS on Saturday.

That's good for a 48% inflation

(09-03-2018 12:15 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 12:08 PM)I_LUV_MEMPHISTIGERS Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 11:08 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 11:03 AM)I_LUV_MEMPHISTIGERS Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 10:48 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  No you don't. This had been debunked in the Wall Street Journal article, (and frankly several other articles). No one does this. The WSJ got their ticket numbers DIRECTLY FROM MEMPHIS THROUGH AN OPEN RECORDS REQUEST. So, if they were wrong, they would have been corrected prior to being sent in or an excuse given.

Thanks for playing.

coming
Argue with your own school who provided the actual attendance numbers, not me. Your beef is with them, not me.

The school is making a case for that.

You've never actually attended the Liberty Bowl, have you? You have have no frame of reference. I could send you pictures but they would be meaningless.

OK, if the record is corrected by the school, then I stand corrected.

They'll take care of it, but without Standardization, It's just he said/she said/ Attendance Data. I suppose I could play Ticket Analyst and provide more Solid Data.

Conversely, in 2015, on a cold, drizzling, November day, I remember sitting in the stands beating the brakes off SMU looking around guesstimatimating there were maybe 3,000 actual fans. Empty Stadium. But they announced 30,000 actual attendance! They apparently reported ticket sales back then.

Enforced NCAA Standardization would resolve all confusion.

(09-03-2018 12:26 PM)The Knight Time Wrote:  Joey Knight tweeted that there were 21,000 butts in RJS on Saturday.

That's good for a 48% inflation

Inflation is a problem everywhere. I wish everyone just used turnstile numbers and quit lying, but doubt that would happen.

We sold +/- 18,000 season tickets, so apparently a lot of those folks didn't bother showing for Elon. But they were counted in attendance numbers.

(09-03-2018 10:50 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-02-2018 03:19 PM)gulfcoastgal Wrote:  One good thing about that WSJ article looks to be fans speaking out and forcing Memphis admin and the LB to get their act together. It'll be interesting to see if any revised numbers or guidelines going forward will be released. The issue needs clarification one way or the other.

Any photo taken from ground level looking at the stands is going to look much fuller than it really is or from one taken from press box level. Also, you have a lot of bleachers seats. It's easier to make a bleacher crowd look fuller than individual chairback seats, because 4 fans in bleachers can take up 7 or 8 spots easily, whereas in chairbacks, 4 people take up exactly 4 seats only. You also had end zone seating tarped off. The sideline seating looked to be maybe half full at most from press box level according to what I saw.

You did had a decent crowd for an FCS opponent. Congrats, it looked decent. I'm not trying to be negative towards your crowd. I already know we have our own attendance issues.

he is right...i went to LSU vs cuse game last year, on tv it looked packed, but in reality the stadium was half empty lol

(09-03-2018 12:15 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 12:08 PM)I_LUV_MEMPHISTIGERS Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 11:08 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 11:03 AM)I_LUV_MEMPHISTIGERS Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 10:48 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  No you don't. This had been debunked in the Wall Street Journal article, (and frankly several other articles). No one does this. The WSJ got their ticket numbers DIRECTLY FROM MEMPHIS THROUGH AN OPEN RECORDS REQUEST. So, if they were wrong, they would have been corrected prior to being sent in or an excuse given.

Thanks for playing.

coming
Argue with your own school who provided the actual attendance numbers, not me. Your beef is with them, not me.

The school is making a case for that.

You've never actually attended the Liberty Bowl, have you? You have have no frame of reference. I could send you pictures but they would be meaningless.

OK, if the record is corrected by the school, then I stand corrected.

They are working on it. At the risk of being redundant, there was an issue with the scanners at the gates not working. Lots of people got waved through without scans to prevent them from standing in long lines with a "real feel" of over 100 degrees.

It is obvious to regulars who were there (including the president of the university) that actual attendance (not some pumped up number) was clearly over 40K.

Then we have another issue of using turnstile count rather than tix sold (which most schools use), and also changing our methodology from game to game sometimes, much less season to season.

I'm to the point that attendance should just be ignored. The whole thing in CFB is just a joke of inflation and inconsistency, so when we KNOW the reported number is way UNDER the actual, we squawk. As we should.

Not sure how they will correct it, though.

(09-02-2018 01:52 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  Memphis - 33,697
Temple - 32,357
USF - 31,217
UConn - 23,081
Tulsa - 18,356
Tulane - 15,478
ECU - TBD

Others did not play at home.

We scanned all the tickets twice, so should come out to about 85k.

Actual butts in seats Sunday....15k?

(09-04-2018 07:57 AM)CoastalJuan Wrote:  

(09-02-2018 01:52 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  Memphis - 33,697
Temple - 32,357
USF - 31,217
UConn - 23,081
Tulsa - 18,356
Tulane - 15,478
ECU - TBD

Others did not play at home.

We scanned all the tickets twice, so should come out to about 85k.

Actual butts in seats Sunday....15k?

I couldn't see the upper deck, but I think more. I was surprised with how big the crowed was for a makeup game vs an FCS opponent coming off of back to back 3-win seasons.

Officially, ECU game was 38,640.

I think there were 22-25K there.

(09-04-2018 07:59 AM)Chappy Wrote:  

(09-04-2018 07:57 AM)CoastalJuan Wrote:  

(09-02-2018 01:52 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  Memphis - 33,697
Temple - 32,357
USF - 31,217
UConn - 23,081
Tulsa - 18,356
Tulane - 15,478
ECU - TBD

Others did not play at home.

We scanned all the tickets twice, so should come out to about 85k.

Actual butts in seats Sunday....15k?

I couldn't see the upper deck, but I think more. I was surprised with how big the crowed was for a makeup game vs an FCS opponent coming off of back to back 3-win seasons.

It was pretty dismal in person. 10% of student section filled. You could sit pretty much anywhere you wanted in the stadium (they weren't checking tickets at the stairs), so no reason for anyone to go up top.

(09-03-2018 12:47 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 12:26 PM)The Knight Time Wrote:  Joey Knight tweeted that there were 21,000 butts in RJS on Saturday.

That's good for a 48% inflation

Inflation is a problem everywhere. I wish everyone just used turnstile numbers and quit lying, but doubt that would happen.

We sold +/- 18,000 season tickets, so apparently a lot of those folks didn't bother showing for Elon. But they were counted in attendance numbers.

Inflation is a problem especially for programs that don't control their own stadium and as such the actual are announced and publicly available. It may not be fair, but it looks very petty to announce 31k when 21k were there. SB Nation Bulls site did an article a couple of years ago that really exposed some serious fudging. Since then attendance has been a source of ridicule by UCF fans. I don't know if others fudge their numbers as much as USF does, but that article had some really big percentages like 60% or something. It was when the program was down. I am sure it is better now.

(09-04-2018 08:14 AM)Noise Penalty Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 12:47 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 12:26 PM)The Knight Time Wrote:  Joey Knight tweeted that there were 21,000 butts in RJS on Saturday.

That's good for a 48% inflation

Inflation is a problem everywhere. I wish everyone just used turnstile numbers and quit lying, but doubt that would happen.

We sold +/- 18,000 season tickets, so apparently a lot of those folks didn't bother showing for Elon. But they were counted in attendance numbers.

Inflation is a problem especially for programs that don't control their own stadium and as such the actual are announced and publicly available. It may not be fair, but it looks very petty to announce 31k when 21k were there. SB Nation Bulls site did an article a couple of years ago that really exposed some serious fudging. Since then attendance has been a source of ridicule by UCF fans. I don't know if others fudge their numbers as much as USF does, but that article had some really big percentages like 60% or something. It was when the program was down. I am sure it is better now.

The problem at Memphis last game was deflation.

(09-03-2018 10:50 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-02-2018 03:19 PM)gulfcoastgal Wrote:  One good thing about that WSJ article looks to be fans speaking out and forcing Memphis admin and the LB to get their act together. It'll be interesting to see if any revised numbers or guidelines going forward will be released. The issue needs clarification one way or the other.

Any photo taken from ground level looking at the stands is going to look much fuller than it really is or from one taken from press box level. Also, you have a lot of bleachers seats. It's easier to make a bleacher crowd look fuller than individual chairback seats, because 4 fans in bleachers can take up 7 or 8 spots easily, whereas in chairbacks, 4 people take up exactly 4 seats only. You also had end zone seating tarped off. The sideline seating looked to be maybe half full at most from press box level according to what I saw.

You did had a decent crowd for an FCS opponent. Congrats, it looked decent. I'm not trying to be negative towards your crowd. I already know we have our own attendance issues.

this

(09-03-2018 10:50 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-02-2018 03:19 PM)gulfcoastgal Wrote:  One good thing about that WSJ article looks to be fans speaking out and forcing Memphis admin and the LB to get their act together. It'll be interesting to see if any revised numbers or guidelines going forward will be released. The issue needs clarification one way or the other.

Any photo taken from ground level looking at the stands is going to look much fuller than it really is or from one taken from press box level. Also, you have a lot of bleachers seats. It's easier to make a bleacher crowd look fuller than individual chairback seats, because 4 fans in bleachers can take up 7 or 8 spots easily, whereas in chairbacks, 4 people take up exactly 4 seats only. You also had end zone seating tarped off. The sideline seating looked to be maybe half full at most from press box level according to what I saw.

You did had a decent crowd for an FCS opponent. Congrats, it looked decent. I'm not trying to be negative towards your crowd. I already know we have our own attendance issues.

The salient point is no one knows actual attendance, but for this particular game announced attendance was understated due to failure to scan all eligible tickets.

(09-04-2018 09:24 AM)Tiger1983 Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 10:50 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-02-2018 03:19 PM)gulfcoastgal Wrote:  One good thing about that WSJ article looks to be fans speaking out and forcing Memphis admin and the LB to get their act together. It'll be interesting to see if any revised numbers or guidelines going forward will be released. The issue needs clarification one way or the other.

Any photo taken from ground level looking at the stands is going to look much fuller than it really is or from one taken from press box level. Also, you have a lot of bleachers seats. It's easier to make a bleacher crowd look fuller than individual chairback seats, because 4 fans in bleachers can take up 7 or 8 spots easily, whereas in chairbacks, 4 people take up exactly 4 seats only. You also had end zone seating tarped off. The sideline seating looked to be maybe half full at most from press box level according to what I saw.

You did had a decent crowd for an FCS opponent. Congrats, it looked decent. I'm not trying to be negative towards your crowd. I already know we have our own attendance issues.

The salient point is no one knows actual attendance, but for this particular game announced attendance was understated due to failure to scan all eligible tickets.

Reports are coming in that the problem was W I D E - spread. This wasn't just at one gate.

Reports are coming in that the Tigers fans are excuse makers and refuse to acknowledge objective reality.

I am continually impressed with the Memphis program. They are growing, and doing it in the right way. I hope they keep Norvell for the long haul. The most important variable regarding sustaining success at the G5 level, is keeping your HC, and retaining key staff.