Clearly Jon Rothstein has some non-objective reason to boost up Nate Hinton. No normal analyst tweets that much about a 7th man on a random borderline top25 team

I must’ve misread the title. Didn’t see where it said Nate Hinton discussion.

(01-31-2019 11:58 AM)pesik Wrote:  

(01-31-2019 11:27 AM)StillJonesing Wrote:  Look man, you wanted me to dig into his numbers. There is obviously a difference in a guy running up numbers when you are blowing out teams and a guy who is the focus of every defense and getting doubled yet still bringing it consistently for 30+ minutes a game over the course of the entire season.

If your guy can sustain his 56% FG and 28 PER I'll be the first to say he needs to be playing more #1, but also great. Infact I said his PER is fantasic in conf play but it still only 8 games for you guys and vs backups.

this is what im talking about with your imaginary context, that not real....
we've only had 1 true blowout all season that was vs ecu, most of our games are close and then we separate the last 5-8 minutes, both teams key players have been in all game almost every game of the season

as a matter fact its the opposite, hinton big games, biggest moments are when we are losing or the game is close...all of his 13 vs byu was in the 1st half when the game was close

11 of his 13 vs tulsa @tulsa was in the 1st half...note tulsa hadn't lost in regulation @tulsa all season (except houston), who has elite defense at home..

also no one is calling for hinton to be #1, i just think your metrics are wonky..you guys use flat stats when your guys are #1, but want to add context (which isnt accurate) when they arent

I literally said it has weaknesses most people understand and one of them is backup players vs starters. I don't write off Backup players either since we've had dumb*** coaches that didn't play all-conference level players. if guys have high Pers guys performing at all conference levels they just aren't getting to play for whatever reason and sometimes it's just idiot coaches that should be playing them. I think most people know how to veiw that if everything else is equal the guy play more minutes and doing it versus starters gets the nod.

also I have never called Gardner the best player in the AAC I said he might be having the best season. I said he might be the best player things like that I never said anything definitve I said let's see the rest of the season but that he's put himself in that conversation read the thread of started. It's not like I just posted player efficiency rating either to make him look good I've been posting that for 10 years

(01-31-2019 08:58 AM)StillJonesing Wrote:  

(01-30-2019 05:21 PM)WhoseHouse? Wrote:  All I did was post the three players conference stats which are the only numbers that matter for a conference award.

Is that even accurate. It's not like the conference separates the stats or anything when they post the league leaders in their twitter, game action and stuff like that. I have a hard time believing it has no weight.

Quote:Also in case you haven't noticed we're almost at the halfway point in conference play, so these numbers are based on a pretty decent sample size.
I provided very little commentary after that. Additionally all three players have two games left against either ECU or Tulane, so moot point.

Gardner has played 7 games and they have all been against good teams. Unfortunately he doesn't get to play this sad sack ECU team as well. 7 games man, it's absolutely a factor at this point.

Quote:I was trying to let the numbers speak for themselves. All three players are having nice seasons. If ECU fans want to pump their guy and write off the rest of the talent in this league, thats fine. The reality is all three of these players can make an excellent case for FOY. Personally, If I had a vote I'd give it to Yetna. I think he's a more complete player than Gardner and has a bigger role on his team than Hinton. However, I wouldn't trade Hinton for either player as he's simply a better fit for UH and our team needs.

I haven't once written Yetna off. I think he's in the conversation for best players in the league in fact not just FOY. Hinton is playing 20 minutes and has played great for the 8 conference games but I don't know how you ignore the 13 OOC games he pretty much sucked at. There has been a huge difference in the two. I mean is he just running up his numbers in blowouts and double digit wins vs these back up scrub dudes like in our game? We had a dude on him that never plays late in that game. I mean that's fine and all it still shows something but it's not the same thing as being the focus of a defense or getting doubled like Gardner.

Basketball reference keeps tracks of each players conference stats, its a useful site. Highly reliable.

I've never said it was a done deal, just that I'd give Yetna my vote right now. His impact on the game is greater as a two way player. Obviously if Gardner goes on a tear and Yetna drops off a little it could swing the other way. Its a close race.

Also again you're understanding of Hinton's play is just so incredibly misguided. The only reason you think that is because he scored a few on yall late after the game was decided. He had nine in the first half against Tulsa. Those came against their starters. Its easy to toss out the ooc games because 1. they weren't against common opponents and 2. its a conference award. Houston played much tougher teams than ECU in the non-con. Thats 100% a factor. Again, continue to write off Hinton if you want. His numbers and every commentator who does a UH game speak to how good he is and how good he's going to be.

Gardner averages 18.9 points a game. Nate Hinton averages 7.9. Discussion is over. No more mentions of Nate Hinton in this thread.

(01-31-2019 01:03 PM)DowdyPirate Wrote:  I must’ve misread the title. Didn’t see where it said Nate Hinton discussion.

Don't be such a douche, OP mentioned him in his first post.

(01-31-2019 01:16 PM)WhoseHouse? Wrote:  Also again you're understanding of Hinton's play is just so incredibly misguided. The only reason you think that is because he scored a few on yall late after the game was decided. He had nine in the first half against Tulsa. Those came against their starters. Its easy to toss out the ooc games because 1. they weren't against common opponents and 2. its a conference award. Houston played much tougher teams than ECU in the non-con. Thats 100% a factor. Again, continue to write off Hinton if you want. His numbers and every commentator who does a UH game speak to how good he is and how good he's going to be.

I agree our OOC was horrible but Gardener's numbers are consistent unlike Hinton and he has and will have played a tougher conference SOS than Houston because he can't play ECU by default. Again do you think Hinton will shoot 56% from the floor like he has the last 8 games or is it just possible that it's fueled by likely unsustainable shooting when he was hooting what 38% or whatever the other 13 games, AAU stats I saw etc. Seems more likely to me he just on a hot streach and yes some of that was garbage time in our game, which is 13% of the sample you are talking about. It's not insignificant.

(01-31-2019 01:25 PM)DowdyPirate Wrote:  Gardner averages 18.9 points a game. Nate Hinton averages 7.9. Discussion is over. No more mentions of Nate Hinton in this thread.

After watching Lebo have Kemp and Richmond on the bench I don't write bench players off completely but this looks different for other reason i've discussed.

(01-31-2019 01:34 PM)StillJonesing Wrote:  

(01-31-2019 01:16 PM)WhoseHouse? Wrote:  Also again you're understanding of Hinton's play is just so incredibly misguided. The only reason you think that is because he scored a few on yall late after the game was decided. He had nine in the first half against Tulsa. Those came against their starters. Its easy to toss out the ooc games because 1. they weren't against common opponents and 2. its a conference award. Houston played much tougher teams than ECU in the non-con. Thats 100% a factor. Again, continue to write off Hinton if you want. His numbers and every commentator who does a UH game speak to how good he is and how good he's going to be.

I agree our OOC was horrible but Gardener's numbers are consistent unlike Hinton and he has and will have played a tougher conference SOS than Houston because he can't play ECU by default. Again do you think Hinton will shoot 56% from the floor like he has the last 8 games or is it just possible that it's fueled by likely unsustainable shooting when he was hooting what 38% or whatever the other 13 games, AAU stats I saw etc. Seems more likely to me he just on a hot streach and yes some of that was garbage time in our game, which is 13% of the sample you are talking about. It's not insignificant.

If you really want to go in depth on it, I think coming off the bench always effects the consistency of a shooters numbers. If Nate comes off the bench and isn't effective right away he doesn't get the chance to shoot out of it and correct his numbers. Starters do. Take Armoni Brooks who is unquestionably our best 3 pt shooter. The number of 1st halves he's had where he's gone like 0-5 or 1-6 from three is staggering. Yet a lot of times he comes right back out in the 2nd and goes 4-5. Its a great thing when a shooter has the green light to just go. Nate doesn't have the yet, in large part because of how good we are. Four or five years ago a guy like Nate would've started for us right away. Now he's coming off the bench. Imo that hurt his numbers initially because he wasn't used to coming off the bench and not being the "guy" for his team. Now he's starting to get comfortable in his role and we're seeing him thrive. Nate's numbers are going to improve a lot from this year to next and then to the following year, as guys like Corey and Armoni graduate. He's the most promising freshman we've had in a while.

USFFan

(01-31-2019 01:34 PM)StillJonesing Wrote:  

(01-31-2019 01:16 PM)WhoseHouse? Wrote:  Also again you're understanding of Hinton's play is just so incredibly misguided. The only reason you think that is because he scored a few on yall late after the game was decided. He had nine in the first half against Tulsa. Those came against their starters. Its easy to toss out the ooc games because 1. they weren't against common opponents and 2. its a conference award. Houston played much tougher teams than ECU in the non-con. Thats 100% a factor. Again, continue to write off Hinton if you want. His numbers and every commentator who does a UH game speak to how good he is and how good he's going to be.

I agree our OOC was horrible but Gardener's numbers are consistent unlike Hinton and he has and will have played a tougher conference SOS than Houston because he can't play ECU by default. Again do you think Hinton will shoot 56% from the floor like he has the last 8 games or is it just possible that it's fueled by likely unsustainable shooting when he was hooting what 38% or whatever the other 13 games, AAU stats I saw etc. Seems more likely to me he just on a hot streach and yes some of that was garbage time in our game, which is 13% of the sample you are talking about. It's not insignificant.

lets stop!!.. the only garbage time points he had was 5 of his 13 from ecu...thats it....every single other point he has scored has been with starters...again most of houston games are close (or losing) the 1st half where we then have huge 2nd halfs...a by product of that is that most key players on both teams play full games..again ecu is the only team we've flat destroyed all season

you keep dropping backups/garbage time trying to discredit...

what crazy about all of this is that gardner is actually the one who benefits MORE of garbage time points..i watched the smu game he was completely shut down..he only started scoring when smu's bench came in at the end of the game..almost every conference game you play, backups come in..unless its a flat destruction most teams on the losing end of blowouts leave their key players in till about a minute left when they are getting blownout..our opponents keep their players in, ecus opponents dont

you are making up context that doesn't exist for hinton, and ignoring any sort of credible context for gardner
this is like all our debates back in the day with ecu football, where youd use your stats to hype ecu like crazy (without real context) in the offseason only to flop in the actual season

Whatever bro, I honestly can't believe I let myself get dragged into this nonsense. Gardner is literally double teamed and the focus of every defense every night , has zero help or space to take the pressure off him, plays to exhaustion and still keeps up the per minute impact he does and not just over 8 games, but the entire season and you want to compare that to a dude coming off the bench as the 6th option. You look ridiculous.

(01-31-2019 06:56 PM)StillJonesing Wrote:  Whatever bro, I honestly can't believe I let myself get dragged into this nonsense. Gardner is literally double teamed and the focus of every defense every night and you want to compare that to a dude coming off the bench as the 6th option. You look ridiculous and it's not just me saying it, where is Hinton's name on this thread? A USF fan posted it no me. Go talk your dumb$hit to him.

The OP mentioned him in the original post. Not sure why saying Hinton is among the best freshman in the league triggers you so much. You should get used to his name because he's going to be around in this league for another 2-3 years garnering media attention and accolades.

(01-31-2019 06:57 PM)StillJonesing Wrote:  Whatever bro, I honestly can't believe I let myself get dragged into this nonsense. Gardner is literally double teamed and the focus of every defense every night , has zero help or space to take the pressure off him, plays to exhaustion and still keeps up the per minute impact he does and not just over 8 games, but the entire season and you want to compare that to a dude coming off the bench as the 6th option. You look ridiculous.

it is literally in the OP & your team is horrible .. we rare a top 15 team...

you look completly ridiculous comparing place in a line up vs a top 15 team...vs that on bottom 300...

you really dont see how silly of a rebuttal that is.. you are blindly biased if you can't see that

(01-31-2019 07:16 PM)pesik Wrote:  

(01-31-2019 06:57 PM)StillJonesing Wrote:  Whatever bro, I honestly can't believe I let myself get dragged into this nonsense. Gardner is literally double teamed and the focus of every defense every night , has zero help or space to take the pressure off him, plays to exhaustion and still keeps up the per minute impact he does and not just over 8 games, but the entire season and you want to compare that to a dude coming off the bench as the 6th option. You look ridiculous.

it is literally in the OP & your team is horrible .. we rare a top 15 team...

you look completly ridiculous comparing place in a line up vs a top 15 team...vs that on bottom 300...

you really dont see how silly of a rebuttal that is.. you are blindly biased if you can't see that

Congratulations, your entire post is irrelevant.

Way easier to produce when nobody guards you and you have no pressure to perform. Gardner has two men on him at all times and is expected to score 20 a game and does.

You’re a clown dude. Drop it.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/ecu-freshman-...16727.html

Only 9 points and 4 rebounds for Yetna yesterday :/

It is official. The commentator in the ECU/UCONN game has said Jayden Gardner WILL win the freshman of the year.

(02-03-2019 02:02 PM)DowdyPirate Wrote:  Only 9 points and 4 rebounds for Yetna yesterday :/

Umm... he got injured early in the second half. Still haven't heard whether he'll miss time or how long. Presuming you didn't know rather than just being a d!ck...

USFFan