With CBS losing the SEC couldn't CBS just move games from CBS sports? Could CBS get buy with what they have now for a few years? They have what the AAC, Mountain West and some WCC games? They could save money for a few years and offer more money come when one of the P5 contracts are up. CBS maybe hoping that Disney may overspend and lower the next contracts.

(01-01-2020 10:36 PM)46566 Wrote:  With CBS losing the SEC couldn't CBS just move games from CBS sports? Could CBS get buy with what they have now for a few years? They have what the AAC, Mountain West and some WCC games? They could save money for a few years and offer more money come when one of the P5 contracts are up. CBS maybe hoping that Disney may overspend and lower the next contracts.

They’d probably have to pay a bit more out to promote while assuming the risk of that level of content competing nationally with ESPN/ABC and Fox. Army might be their most national remaining pull...do you want that going H2H with a top SEC, Big Ten, or Notre Dame game elsewhere?

If they wanted to switch gears and start airing basketball when the season picked up, it would be in that murky non-conference territory or those tournaments (and doesn’t ESPN already have some of those better ones locked down?).

It would be quite a changeup. Shifting from mostly relevant contests to something more niche. Then again, this battle over top conferences was done in part because Saturdays outside of college football season are pretty lame content-wise. So, irrelevant football/basketball or infomercials?

(12-31-2019 11:10 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  CBS is in the same kind of game with content as NBC, so, CBS could be in the market for Notre Dame with that kind of limited run.

I think it’s becoming more apparent NBC and CBS are passing on these conference network bundles for what these conferences want. All the power to ESPN and Fox gobbling up content, but, I think NBC and CBS are on the right side of this.

It’s kind of a shame Notre Dame and BYU are the two consistent independents, and are both spoken for. I could see CBS investing more in Army if they would show some consistency with success. It’s tough tapping the Cadets for that marquee slot the same way NBC does it with Notre Dame. UConn and UMass won’t get close anytime soon. Liberty isn’t quite their dish.

The PAC’s in position, though. Can they not stumble over themselves is the question.

Liberty is an interesting case. I read an article from like ‘86 or ‘89 when they were 1-AA and it focused on Falwell’s desire to be Notre Dame of the East in sports (specifically football). I’m guessing they’re an evangelical school? There is quite a potential fan base sitting out there.

(01-01-2020 11:12 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  

(01-01-2020 10:36 PM)46566 Wrote:  With CBS losing the SEC couldn't CBS just move games from CBS sports? Could CBS get buy with what they have now for a few years? They have what the AAC, Mountain West and some WCC games? They could save money for a few years and offer more money come when one of the P5 contracts are up. CBS maybe hoping that Disney may overspend and lower the next contracts.

They’d probably have to pay a bit more out to promote while assuming the risk of that level of content competing nationally with ESPN/ABC and Fox. Army might be their most national remaining pull...do you want that going H2H with a top SEC, Big Ten, or Notre Dame game elsewhere?

If they wanted to switch gears and start airing basketball when the season picked up, it would be in that murky non-conference territory or those tournaments (and doesn’t ESPN already have some of those better ones locked down?).

It would be quite a changeup. Shifting from mostly relevant contests to something more niche. Then again, this battle over top conferences was done in part because Saturdays outside of college football season are pretty lame content-wise. So, irrelevant football/basketball or infomercials?

In my mind there's only so much and time. ESPN owns tier 1 for ACC, SEC ,Big 12, and the like. There is only a certain amount of time to show games on ESPN and ESPN 2. I'm sure overflow games can be put on ESPN u or news. Each of the P5 conferences have a network also. You could show a game or 2 on the ABC affiliate. How many of the P5 would want to be on ESPN+. You could have noon SEC, ACC and AAC matches at the start. The later you go you have to add the big 10, big 12 and pac 12. That's just the big conferences an the biggest G5 in the AAC.

I think ESPN has the wealth of choice hit could lead to conferences wanting tv kickoff times and channels they want. It could lead to the Big 10 and Pac 12 to go fox. If anything it'll just going to hurt the G5. MAC would be okay with there weekday games in November, as would the sun Belt weekday games. There might be agreements on tier right of other conferences I'm unaware of it adding a extra 2 or 3 games a weekend could cause Domino effect down the line.

I'm thinking maybe take a season to promote the AAC and mountain west. They could hope a conference is disgruntled enough to willing to get a pay cut or a slight boost in pay.

(01-01-2020 11:46 PM)46566 Wrote:  I'm thinking maybe take a season to promote the AAC and mountain west. They could hope a conference is disgruntled enough to willing to get a pay cut or a slight boost in pay.

For what it costs for national broadcast and CBS’ own model (commercial-break the **** out of it), that’s a tough sell for content that isn’t in the national conversation. Even for a rental season or two until they could ink a major conference, who’s paying for this?

It works when it’s buried deeper down the dial, since there isn’t national money rolling into production, and sponsors aren’t breaking bank to get into it. Just moving something up to broadcast puts the pressure on CBS to recoup. It doesn’t sound like them. They’d probably give the slot to local affiliates to handle accordingly instead.

It sucks for us who want to see something, and for anyone who pulls for these schools in places not in the “anointed” clique. It’s like they’re stuck out there. We’re paying more to find them out there, and it’s not like top dollar is spent on production...can’t catch a break.

esayam Wrote:Liberty is an interesting case. I read an article from like ‘86 or ‘89 when they were 1-AA and it focused on Falwell’s desire to be Notre Dame of the East in sports (specifically football). I’m guessing they’re an evangelical school? There is quite a potential fan base sitting out there.

Liberty was the right school to test the rules for upgrading to FBS. Potential is there, but, oh, the politics (not just the institution itself, but amongst other schools and conferences toward them). Yet, if BYU can get a deal from ESPN, can’t imagine Liberty wandering around blind in the wilderness for terribly long. Seemed like a shoe-in for Stadium, but, that network already has a lot of holdings.

(01-02-2020 01:03 AM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  

(01-01-2020 11:46 PM)46566 Wrote:  I'm thinking maybe take a season to promote the AAC and mountain west. They could hope a conference is disgruntled enough to willing to get a pay cut or a slight boost in pay.

For what it costs for national broadcast and CBS’ own model (commercial-break the **** out of it), that’s a tough sell for content that isn’t in the national conversation. Even for a rental season or two until they could ink a major conference, who’s paying for this?

It works when it’s buried deeper down the dial, since there isn’t national money rolling into production, and sponsors aren’t breaking bank to get into it. Just moving something up to broadcast puts the pressure on CBS to recoup. It doesn’t sound like them. They’d probably give the slot to local affiliates to handle accordingly instead.

It sucks for us who want to see something, and for anyone who pulls for these schools in places not in the “anointed” clique. It’s like they’re stuck out there. We’re paying more to find them out there, and it’s not like top dollar is spent on production...can’t catch a break.

esayam Wrote:Liberty is an interesting case. I read an article from like ‘86 or ‘89 when they were 1-AA and it focused on Falwell’s desire to be Notre Dame of the East in sports (specifically football). I’m guessing they’re an evangelical school? There is quite a potential fan base sitting out there.

Liberty was the right school to test the rules for upgrading to FBS. Potential is there, but, oh, the politics (not just the institution itself, but amongst other schools and conferences toward them). Yet, if BYU can get a deal from ESPN, can’t imagine Liberty wandering around blind in the wilderness for terribly long. Seemed like a shoe-in for Stadium, but, that network already has a lot of holdings.

Being the Notre Dame of evangelicals is a tall order because there are so many branches of evangelicalism that don't necessarily have warm and fuzzy feelings about other branches even when doctrine is pretty similarly aligned. Plus you've already got Baylor with a big chunk of loyalty.

Depending on how broadly you define evangelicalism there are as many as 62 million evangelicals in the US compared to 70 million Catholics but there aren't many Catholics who would find Notre Dame's "brand" of Catholicism offensive. To get to 62 million evangelicals you are including a lot of the charismatic movement that would take umbrage at Liberty's religious teachings (and Baylor's) and several Anabaptist sects that would never identify with Liberty (or Baylor). The churches of Christ are typically considered evangelical and they don't always agree if church of Christ colleges like Pepperdine and Harding are in line with their beliefs and don't even bother telling them how great Baylor or Liberty is.

Liberty is affiliated with the Southern Baptist Conservatives of Virginia which is supportive of the Southern Baptist Convention that has about half as many churches as the Baptist General Association of Virginia which is SBC affiliated.

It gets sort of like the bit in Life of Brian sorting out who is in which sect in the scene where they see a guy by himself and someone asks who is he and is told he's the Judean Popular People's Front.

Those differences mean finding the sort of unity Notre Dame or BYU enjoys is improbable. They can win games, they can draw crowds which ought to grow as they enjoy success on the field but millions of evangelicals will never claim Liberty the way many Catholics claim Notre Dame or Latter Day Saints claim BYU because evangelical is such a broad term.

(01-02-2020 03:14 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  Being the Notre Dame of evangelicals is a tall order because there are so many branches of evangelicalism that don't necessarily have warm and fuzzy feelings about other branches even when doctrine is pretty similarly aligned. Plus you've already got Baylor with a big chunk of loyalty.

Depending on how broadly you define evangelicalism there are as many as 62 million evangelicals in the US compared to 70 million Catholics but there aren't many Catholics who would find Notre Dame's "brand" of Catholicism offensive. To get to 62 million evangelicals you are including a lot of the charismatic movement that would take umbrage at Liberty's religious teachings (and Baylor's) and several Anabaptist sects that would never identify with Liberty (or Baylor). The churches of Christ are typically considered evangelical and they don't always agree if church of Christ colleges like Pepperdine and Harding are in line with their beliefs and don't even bother telling them how great Baylor or Liberty is.

Liberty is affiliated with the Southern Baptist Conservatives of Virginia which is supportive of the Southern Baptist Convention that has about half as many churches as the Baptist General Association of Virginia which is SBC affiliated.

It gets sort of like the bit in Life of Brian sorting out who is in which sect in the scene where they see a guy by himself and someone asks who is he and is told he's the Judean Popular People's Front.

Those differences mean finding the sort of unity Notre Dame or BYU enjoys is improbable. They can win games, they can draw crowds which ought to grow as they enjoy success on the field but millions of evangelicals will never claim Liberty the way many Catholics claim Notre Dame or Latter Day Saints claim BYU because evangelical is such a broad term.

Well said. Doctrinally, I'm a lot closer to Liberty than to Baylor, but I have no loyalty to either one of them. There are things about both that make me uncomfortable, and I did not attend either one of them. I have friends and family connected to both schools. In the churches I have been part of, loyalty is to the Big State Schools. Those who went to Baylor or a much smaller school will be loyal to those schools. Outside of Texas, Baylor has little following among church people, as it is connected with a state group of Baptists, and is not directly connected to the SBC. As arkstfan mentioned, our support is spread a thousand ways.

Liberty has built a national base of supporters. However, I don't see them becoming to evangelicals what Notre Dame is to Catholics or what BYU is to the LDS population. We're too fragmented for that.

I'm thinking of going to Liberty next year. People are free to think and believe what they want. I don't have to agree and can keeps separate most of the time.

(01-02-2020 12:40 PM)Steve1981 Wrote:  I'm thinking of going to Liberty next year. People are free to think and believe what they want. I don't have to agree and can keeps separate most of the time.

Me too, I am looking at some of there Master's programs. Very flexible program offerings.