The CUSA model is not sustainable in its current form. When Marshall joined, there was concern regarding the travel expenses. The large TV contract offset those concerns. Remember all the minor sports travel all over the conference spending large amounts of money. After MU joined, TCU and Army left and then other members left to form the AAC. The new TV contract took a hit or was mismanaged so the cash is not there for travel. The travel expense is a very large for the MU athletic budget.

ODU has admitted that the travel expense is costing them money. I am sure the other members are having cash flow issues.

(04-10-2020 07:46 AM)HTOWN_HERD Wrote:  Listen, your knowledge of these things is wayyy above my own. Thanks for the breakdown, and that explains a lot to me. Well if that’s the case, and IF Marshall’s administration is talking to the MAC then I would think it has nothing to do with CUSA financially and everything to do with the MAC expanding. Thus, leaving the door open for Marshall to walk out of CUSA without paying an exit fee and joining a much more geographical fit in the MAC. The MAC has a better tv deal with more money and travel cost would be cut immensely. That makes sense to me.

While its certainly possible for Marshall to leave cusa, i dont see why they would be free to leave without paying an exit fee.

(04-10-2020 08:54 AM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 07:46 AM)HTOWN_HERD Wrote:  Listen, your knowledge of these things is wayyy above my own. Thanks for the breakdown, and that explains a lot to me. Well if that’s the case, and IF Marshall’s administration is talking to the MAC then I would think it has nothing to do with CUSA financially and everything to do with the MAC expanding. Thus, leaving the door open for Marshall to walk out of CUSA without paying an exit fee and joining a much more geographical fit in the MAC. The MAC has a better tv deal with more money and travel cost would be cut immensely. That makes sense to me.

While its certainly possible for Marshall to leave cusa, i dont see why they would be free to leave without paying an exit fee.

I meant to say that it has nothing to do with CUSA financially going belly up and dissolving. However, in the worst case scenario the previous poster stated that the “financial crisis” may allow members to leave without paying exit fee.

(04-09-2020 10:54 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  The MAC would probably expand if the combination was Marshall and JMU. They improve the league. JMU would’ve been invited 5+ years ago if UMass took the invite. The MAC sees JMU as a stand-by #14 if a home run #13 comes up.

Read on the Marshall board the Toledo Blade had an article hinting the MAC could expand (though I can’t find and haven’t seen it).

I agree the MAC +Marshall -Buffalo is the perfect league geographically.

Think about this like Mongolia.

Mid American: Ohio, Miami, Kent, BG, Akron, Toledo, EMU, WMU, CMU, Ball St
Outer Mid American: NIU, Buffalo, Marshall

The caliphate is at its maximum with NIU, Buffalo and Marshall involved.

(04-10-2020 07:59 AM)Flat Tire 2 Wrote:  The CUSA model is not sustainable in its current form. When Marshall joined, there was concern regarding the travel expenses. The large TV contract offset those concerns. Remember all the minor sports travel all over the conference spending large amounts of money. After MU joined, TCU and Army left and then other members left to form the AAC. The new TV contract took a hit or was mismanaged so the cash is not there for travel. The travel expense is a very large for the MU athletic budget.

ODU has admitted that the travel expense is costing them money. I am sure the other members are having cash flow issues.

As far as the CUSA model the obvious solution is to increase the divisionalization of subsidy sports.

Individual sports is not an challenge ... the way to not pay the Cross Country team to journey all of the from San Antonio to Philadelphia or from Boca Raton to El Paso is to not do it. Problem solved. Don't even need to strictly divisionalize things, just say something like you have to see 4 schools at a meet twice and 6 schools once (adjusted down in sports with fewer than 14 schools).

Men's soccer is not an issue ... it is five Eastern division schools, UAB and South Carolina, and Kentucky as affiliates ... so the only western division school that plays is UAB, which is not a big travel cost driver for the Eastern division schools.

So the issue is Baseball(12), MBBall, WBBall, WSoccer(14), Softball(12) and women's volleyball (13).

Basketball, they might continue as they do, given that it is a revenue sport, but Baseball, Women's Soccer, Softball and Women's Volleyball can be heavily divisionalized, and level things out in the conference championship.

Mind, baseball is tricky, since both schools that skip baseball are Western schools, so two balanced divisions would have one eastern school playing in the western division. But then, since you finish baseball with a tournament rather than a CCG, you could get creative, and have three, four team divisions, playing your own division in a home and away double round robin and half of the other two, for 10 three-game series.

(04-10-2020 09:55 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 07:59 AM)Flat Tire 2 Wrote:  The CUSA model is not sustainable in its current form. When Marshall joined, there was concern regarding the travel expenses. The large TV contract offset those concerns. Remember all the minor sports travel all over the conference spending large amounts of money. After MU joined, TCU and Army left and then other members left to form the AAC. The new TV contract took a hit or was mismanaged so the cash is not there for travel. The travel expense is a very large for the MU athletic budget.

ODU has admitted that the travel expense is costing them money. I am sure the other members are having cash flow issues.

As far as the CUSA model the obvious solution is to increase the divisionalization of subsidy sports.

Individual sports is not an challenge ... the way to not pay the Cross Country team to journey all of the from San Antonio to Philadelphia or from Boca Raton to El Paso is to not do it. Problem solved. Don't even need to strictly divisionalize things, just say something like you have to see 4 schools at a meet twice and 6 schools once (adjusted down in sports with fewer than 14 schools).

Men's soccer is not an issue ... it is five Eastern division schools, UAB and South Carolina, and Kentucky as affiliates ... so the only western division school that plays is UAB, which is not a big travel cost driver for the Eastern division schools.

So the issue is Baseball(12), MBBall, WBBall, WSoccer(14), Softball(12) and women's volleyball (13).

Basketball, they might continue as they do, given that it is a revenue sport, but Baseball, Women's Soccer, Softball and Women's Volleyball can be heavily divisionalized, and level things out in the conference championship.

Mind, baseball is tricky, since both schools that skip baseball are Western schools, so two balanced divisions would have one eastern school playing in the western division. But then, since you finish baseball with a tournament rather than a CCG, you could get creative, and have three, four team divisions, playing your own division in a home and away double round robin and half of the other two, for 10 three-game series.

The one problem with your idea, is how do the teams get a full schedule of events or games. You are making a very good argument for regional conferences or bus leagues. When Marshall was in the MAC, most of the teams could either jump on a bus or a few minivans to away games. MU could travel to OU and close schools and not even have to spend the night on the road for a game. The ACC does this with the Big Four in NC and the Virginia schools. Close compact conference.

(04-10-2020 10:11 AM)Flat Tire 2 Wrote:  The one problem with your idea, is how do the teams get a full schedule of events or games. ...

By doing a double (or maybe triple, depending on the sport and the number of conference games needed) round robin in division and then filling out however many cross division games required ... but typically half of the other division or less.

The "10 three game series" in baseball was taken straight from the CUSA baseball scheduling format, where CUSA schools play all but one other CUSA school in one three game series. So play six series against your "mini-division" schools and four series cross division ... so it's exactly two cross division road trips. The tricky thing is which four team division gets the Florida pair, but even there, that is a classical travel partner situation, where the "other two" (whoever they are) fly down, each play a series against one of the FxU's, then each play a series against the other FxU's, then fly home.

Indeed, similar to FB. The biggest revenue sport, and Marshall plays six games in the division and two across ... so basically one cross division road trip.

So if you have an eight team double elimination tournament, three division winners and one wild card have a first round bye and the other two second place teams and two best third place teams are placed into the first round. A maximum of two first round teams from a division, so easy to put them into opposing brackets.

(04-10-2020 09:20 AM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 10:54 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  The MAC would probably expand if the combination was Marshall and JMU. They improve the league. JMU would’ve been invited 5+ years ago if UMass took the invite. The MAC sees JMU as a stand-by #14 if a home run #13 comes up.

Read on the Marshall board the Toledo Blade had an article hinting the MAC could expand (though I can’t find and haven’t seen it).

I agree the MAC +Marshall -Buffalo is the perfect league geographically.

Think about this like Mongolia.

Mid American: Ohio, Miami, Kent, BG, Akron, Toledo, EMU, WMU, CMU, Ball St
Outer Mid American: NIU, Buffalo, Marshall

The caliphate is at its maximum with NIU, Buffalo and Marshall involved.

Inner or outer, that's 13 members. Either one has to go, or a 14th has to come in. Imo MAC is best at 12, so ...

(04-10-2020 01:17 PM)pvk75 Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 09:20 AM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 10:54 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  The MAC would probably expand if the combination was Marshall and JMU. They improve the league. JMU would’ve been invited 5+ years ago if UMass took the invite. The MAC sees JMU as a stand-by #14 if a home run #13 comes up.

Read on the Marshall board the Toledo Blade had an article hinting the MAC could expand (though I can’t find and haven’t seen it).

I agree the MAC +Marshall -Buffalo is the perfect league geographically.

Think about this like Mongolia.

Mid American: Ohio, Miami, Kent, BG, Akron, Toledo, EMU, WMU, CMU, Ball St
Outer Mid American: NIU, Buffalo, Marshall

The caliphate is at its maximum with NIU, Buffalo and Marshall involved.

Inner or outer, that's 13 members. Either one has to go, or a 14th has to come in. Imo MAC is best at 12, so ...

So out with NIU?

(04-09-2020 12:21 PM)HTOWN_HERD Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 11:09 AM)GreenBison Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 09:24 AM)wsherdfan Wrote:  OK - disclaimer: There is no official confirmation, so like many comments on this board, it is purely conjecture on my part.

I believe there is a $7 mil exit fee for a member leaving for a different conference. But - IF CUSA were to dissolve due to financial hardship, I would think the exit fee would be null & void.
My main thought vis a vi the members is this:
IF the conference was to disband, where would your school most likely go?
I know for the newer members, they moved up from FCS level to FBS level, meaning there would not be a horizontal path to another G5 conference affiliation. For the older members of CUSA 2.0, they came from other G5 conferences that prob no longer exist...
Where would you see your team going if CUSA goes belly up?

If CUSA goes belly up, the remaining schools will just form two small regional confernces. Simple as that. No Exit Fee and No Entrance Fee. I don't understand why people want to over think this. The CUSA East schools will form a new conference and so will CUSA west schools.

Problem solved.

Please don’t take this as me being argumentative because I’m not. I am curious how it will be just that easy to start a new conference? Who pays for the start up fees of said new conference? There are bound to be cost associated with that. What if some of the members don’t want to come along? There only only 7 teams in CUSA East so you’ll need to pick up 3 additional members. If the Sun Belt survives then you can forgot about any of their teams paying an exit fee to come join us. That leaves adding FCS teams and Liberty. Furthermore, who will run this new conference? Will they be better than Judy? What kind of media deal can it get? No one wants this steaming pile of poo that we are in now. We play games on Facebook for crying out loud. Just breaking the same teams into something smaller isn’t going to change that.

I honestly don’t know the answers to these questions, and it seems like an awful lot of unknowns to me. It doesn’t mean that you aren’t 100% correct in your assessment, but that’s a lot of things that have to come together for it to be the same or better than where we are now.

Those are all very good points. And I don't know the answers either. I just don't see the MAC splitting their pie with another mouth to feed when money is driving the bus. We're not the Marshall of old anymore.

(04-11-2020 12:10 AM)GreenBison Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 12:21 PM)HTOWN_HERD Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 11:09 AM)GreenBison Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 09:24 AM)wsherdfan Wrote:  OK - disclaimer: There is no official confirmation, so like many comments on this board, it is purely conjecture on my part.

I believe there is a $7 mil exit fee for a member leaving for a different conference. But - IF CUSA were to dissolve due to financial hardship, I would think the exit fee would be null & void.
My main thought vis a vi the members is this:
IF the conference was to disband, where would your school most likely go?
I know for the newer members, they moved up from FCS level to FBS level, meaning there would not be a horizontal path to another G5 conference affiliation. For the older members of CUSA 2.0, they came from other G5 conferences that prob no longer exist...
Where would you see your team going if CUSA goes belly up?

If CUSA goes belly up, the remaining schools will just form two small regional confernces. Simple as that. No Exit Fee and No Entrance Fee. I don't understand why people want to over think this. The CUSA East schools will form a new conference and so will CUSA west schools.

Problem solved.

Please don’t take this as me being argumentative because I’m not. I am curious how it will be just that easy to start a new conference? Who pays for the start up fees of said new conference? There are bound to be cost associated with that. What if some of the members don’t want to come along? There only only 7 teams in CUSA East so you’ll need to pick up 3 additional members. If the Sun Belt survives then you can forgot about any of their teams paying an exit fee to come join us. That leaves adding FCS teams and Liberty. Furthermore, who will run this new conference? Will they be better than Judy? What kind of media deal can it get? No one wants this steaming pile of poo that we are in now. We play games on Facebook for crying out loud. Just breaking the same teams into something smaller isn’t going to change that.

I honestly don’t know the answers to these questions, and it seems like an awful lot of unknowns to me. It doesn’t mean that you aren’t 100% correct in your assessment, but that’s a lot of things that have to come together for it to be the same or better than where we are now.

Those are all very good points. And I don't know the answers either. I just don't see the MAC splitting their pie with another mouth to feed when money is driving the bus. We're not the Marshall of old anymore.

I hate to say it because I respect Marshall's program and would like App to share a conference with them, but I agree with this.

Marshall had an incredible run under the MAC banner, with Heisman Trophy contenders, BCS AQ upsets, several championships, and more. Definitely the best five year 1-AA/FCS move up in history.

Then, seemingly pairing with the move to C-USA 2.0, there was a dropoff. Not a complete dropoff, considering Marshall has had a conference championship and several other good seasons, but there has been a drop nonetheless.

What happened that changed the momentum from the late 90's and early 2000's? Was it a coaching change? Was switching to C-USA a jarring step up in competition? Was it just that it is really hard to sustain a run that had great college players like Moss, Pennington, and Leftwich? Some combination?

Again, huge respect for Marshall. I am thrilled with the start to FBS that App has enjoyed, but I envy the Heisman contention, multiple top 25 finishes (including a top 10), and all around success Marshall had.

One point about CUSA is that it hasn't tried for the least cost approach to competition in "it's present form", so its sustainability in its present form has never been put to the test.

Abandon the single round robin then formation of pods based on record ... which while it is in theory good for the NET of the higher ranking schools, is not going to turn the CUSA into a multi-bid conference, so spending the travel money on what can be pods that cross half the continent doesn't seem to be worth it.

Instead, go divisional, play a round robin in the division, play a single game cross division, and then play the return legs of a double round robin in division. 19 conference games, but rather than up to 12 of 18 cross-division, which is possible at the moment depending on how the season rankings are set up, 12 of them in division and 7 cross division ... and all of them known well in advance to get the best deals on travel arrangements.

And split up the Men and Women's BBall tournment and alternate them between a western and an eastern site that can support a tournament.

It seems a lot more likely that the bar rattling of the Eastern teams in CUSA is going to end up CUSA shifting away from it's "let's spend more than we actually HAVE to on travel, everybody!!!" approach which it is pursuing at the moment, than in any breakaway which will lose access to the Access Bowl race and an NCAA autobid and future earnings from all of the existing NCAA units any of the breakway schools might have been the source for.

(04-11-2020 12:32 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  

(04-11-2020 12:10 AM)GreenBison Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 12:21 PM)HTOWN_HERD Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 11:09 AM)GreenBison Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 09:24 AM)wsherdfan Wrote:  OK - disclaimer: There is no official confirmation, so like many comments on this board, it is purely conjecture on my part.

I believe there is a $7 mil exit fee for a member leaving for a different conference. But - IF CUSA were to dissolve due to financial hardship, I would think the exit fee would be null & void.
My main thought vis a vi the members is this:
IF the conference was to disband, where would your school most likely go?
I know for the newer members, they moved up from FCS level to FBS level, meaning there would not be a horizontal path to another G5 conference affiliation. For the older members of CUSA 2.0, they came from other G5 conferences that prob no longer exist...
Where would you see your team going if CUSA goes belly up?

If CUSA goes belly up, the remaining schools will just form two small regional confernces. Simple as that. No Exit Fee and No Entrance Fee. I don't understand why people want to over think this. The CUSA East schools will form a new conference and so will CUSA west schools.

Problem solved.

Please don’t take this as me being argumentative because I’m not. I am curious how it will be just that easy to start a new conference? Who pays for the start up fees of said new conference? There are bound to be cost associated with that. What if some of the members don’t want to come along? There only only 7 teams in CUSA East so you’ll need to pick up 3 additional members. If the Sun Belt survives then you can forgot about any of their teams paying an exit fee to come join us. That leaves adding FCS teams and Liberty. Furthermore, who will run this new conference? Will they be better than Judy? What kind of media deal can it get? No one wants this steaming pile of poo that we are in now. We play games on Facebook for crying out loud. Just breaking the same teams into something smaller isn’t going to change that.

I honestly don’t know the answers to these questions, and it seems like an awful lot of unknowns to me. It doesn’t mean that you aren’t 100% correct in your assessment, but that’s a lot of things that have to come together for it to be the same or better than where we are now.

Those are all very good points. And I don't know the answers either. I just don't see the MAC splitting their pie with another mouth to feed when money is driving the bus. We're not the Marshall of old anymore.

I hate to say it because I respect Marshall's program and would like App to share a conference with them, but I agree with this.

Marshall had an incredible run under the MAC banner, with Heisman Trophy contenders, BCS AQ upsets, several championships, and more. Definitely the best five year 1-AA/FCS move up in history.

Then, seemingly pairing with the move to C-USA 2.0, there was a dropoff. Not a complete dropoff, considering Marshall has had a conference championship and several other good seasons, but there has been a drop nonetheless.

What happened that changed the momentum from the late 90's and early 2000's? Was it a coaching change? Was switching to C-USA a jarring step up in competition? Was it just that it is really hard to sustain a run that had great college players like Moss, Pennington, and Leftwich? Some combination?

Again, huge respect for Marshall. I am thrilled with the start to FBS that App has enjoyed, but I envy the Heisman contention, multiple top 25 finishes (including a top 10), and all around success Marshall had.

The last ten years we have a Coach who is a "safe" choice. He will win you 8-9 games a year, but will also lose games he shouldn't. Thus always the bridesmaid. The administration/certain boosters are happy with this but, the overall fan base is not and it starting to show at the gates.

Cheap shot from some troll aside, the MAC already went through the UMass, Temple and Marshall come-and-go shakes to its stability. Also, recall NIU left and came back, too, and some years back there was an internal move to get EMU out. All that prompted a desire for stability in the shadow of the B1G. It is not C-USA, which exists in a tangle of the SE, ACC, AAC and even Sun Belt neighborhoods.

Agree Marshall is not the same Marhsall it was, but neither is the MAC for those reasons. The Covid-19 crisis is changing the ball game (pardon the pun) for everyone. Hopefully, it and fan reactions will shake out by 2023/24/25, when the P5 CORs and TV contracts come into play. That's when many agree realignments will happen, if any. Imo, that hasn't changed, except there will be new issues post-Covid-19 involved.

Post UConn, the Covid-19 crisis makes the AAC's move to stand pat look smart. All that is why my bet is Buffalo will eventually look good for all sports to the AAC. Of all the MAC programs, it is the most likely. It fits the enrollment, market, etc. Regardless, that will leave a slot open for JMU, WKU, whoever.

But I don't think the MAC will be eager to divide the small pie it has by 14, especially now and after the financial impacts caused by the Covid-19 crisis. Imo, in any case, expansion to 14 would have to provide some coverage to at least patch the financial problems.

I do not know what Marshall fans want, but the mention by anyone of going back to the MAC could just be a reflection of unhappiness with the way things are ... as noted by Marshall fans here. Marshall had success it its second MAC go-around, and fans remember that.

But possibilities are why we have so many threads and posts. Marshall could come back in, with JMU, as IWokeUpLikeThis noted. Buffalo could leave for the AAC, leaving a slot for whoever. Marshall could stand pat or move somewhere else, and Buffalo could leave anyway.

Right now the game is wait-and-see.

(04-11-2020 12:32 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  

(04-11-2020 12:10 AM)GreenBison Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 12:21 PM)HTOWN_HERD Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 11:09 AM)GreenBison Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 09:24 AM)wsherdfan Wrote:  OK - disclaimer: There is no official confirmation, so like many comments on this board, it is purely conjecture on my part.

I believe there is a $7 mil exit fee for a member leaving for a different conference. But - IF CUSA were to dissolve due to financial hardship, I would think the exit fee would be null & void.
My main thought vis a vi the members is this:
IF the conference was to disband, where would your school most likely go?
I know for the newer members, they moved up from FCS level to FBS level, meaning there would not be a horizontal path to another G5 conference affiliation. For the older members of CUSA 2.0, they came from other G5 conferences that prob no longer exist...
Where would you see your team going if CUSA goes belly up?

If CUSA goes belly up, the remaining schools will just form two small regional confernces. Simple as that. No Exit Fee and No Entrance Fee. I don't understand why people want to over think this. The CUSA East schools will form a new conference and so will CUSA west schools.

Problem solved.

Please don’t take this as me being argumentative because I’m not. I am curious how it will be just that easy to start a new conference? Who pays for the start up fees of said new conference? There are bound to be cost associated with that. What if some of the members don’t want to come along? There only only 7 teams in CUSA East so you’ll need to pick up 3 additional members. If the Sun Belt survives then you can forgot about any of their teams paying an exit fee to come join us. That leaves adding FCS teams and Liberty. Furthermore, who will run this new conference? Will they be better than Judy? What kind of media deal can it get? No one wants this steaming pile of poo that we are in now. We play games on Facebook for crying out loud. Just breaking the same teams into something smaller isn’t going to change that.

I honestly don’t know the answers to these questions, and it seems like an awful lot of unknowns to me. It doesn’t mean that you aren’t 100% correct in your assessment, but that’s a lot of things that have to come together for it to be the same or better than where we are now.

Those are all very good points. And I don't know the answers either. I just don't see the MAC splitting their pie with another mouth to feed when money is driving the bus. We're not the Marshall of old anymore.

I hate to say it because I respect Marshall's program and would like App to share a conference with them, but I agree with this.

Marshall had an incredible run under the MAC banner, with Heisman Trophy contenders, BCS AQ upsets, several championships, and more. Definitely the best five year 1-AA/FCS move up in history.

Then, seemingly pairing with the move to C-USA 2.0, there was a dropoff. Not a complete dropoff, considering Marshall has had a conference championship and several other good seasons, but there has been a drop nonetheless.

What happened that changed the momentum from the late 90's and early 2000's? Was it a coaching change? Was switching to C-USA a jarring step up in competition? Was it just that it is really hard to sustain a run that had great college players like Moss, Pennington, and Leftwich? Some combination?

Again, huge respect for Marshall. I am thrilled with the start to FBS that App has enjoyed, but I envy the Heisman contention, multiple top 25 finishes (including a top 10), and all around success Marshall had.

Speaking of the difference of competition UCF left the MAC to CUSA at the same time and they were not good in the MAC and did much better in CUSA. So competition is less relevant than you might think (also some really great non-marshal MAC teams were around back then such as the year BGSU, Miami, and NIU had really big year at the same time).

This is one MAC fan that says - Marshall come on back...

Bring friends - any combo of WKU/MTSU/ODU or even Appy State or JMU would do...
We would have to lop off some dead weight ( several MAC schools that would be better served in FCS ). Keep it at 14 schools in a new north/south division setup...
As far as negative hospitality in Huntington, I have been down there six times for games... Always a good time, and a lot of mutual respect on both sides...
Toledo fans experience five times as much hostility in C-bus when we play o$u...

(04-10-2020 09:20 AM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 10:54 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  The MAC would probably expand if the combination was Marshall and JMU. They improve the league. JMU would’ve been invited 5+ years ago if UMass took the invite. The MAC sees JMU as a stand-by #14 if a home run #13 comes up.

Read on the Marshall board the Toledo Blade had an article hinting the MAC could expand (though I can’t find and haven’t seen it).

I agree the MAC +Marshall -Buffalo is the perfect league geographically.

Think about this like Mongolia.

Mid American: Ohio, Miami, Kent, BG, Akron, Toledo, EMU, WMU, CMU, Ball St
Outer Mid American: NIU, Buffalo, Marshall

The caliphate is at its maximum with NIU, Buffalo and Marshall involved.

Muck the FAC!

(04-11-2020 12:32 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  

(04-11-2020 12:10 AM)GreenBison Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 12:21 PM)HTOWN_HERD Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 11:09 AM)GreenBison Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 09:24 AM)wsherdfan Wrote:  OK - disclaimer: There is no official confirmation, so like many comments on this board, it is purely conjecture on my part.

I believe there is a $7 mil exit fee for a member leaving for a different conference. But - IF CUSA were to dissolve due to financial hardship, I would think the exit fee would be null & void.
My main thought vis a vi the members is this:
IF the conference was to disband, where would your school most likely go?
I know for the newer members, they moved up from FCS level to FBS level, meaning there would not be a horizontal path to another G5 conference affiliation. For the older members of CUSA 2.0, they came from other G5 conferences that prob no longer exist...
Where would you see your team going if CUSA goes belly up?

If CUSA goes belly up, the remaining schools will just form two small regional confernces. Simple as that. No Exit Fee and No Entrance Fee. I don't understand why people want to over think this. The CUSA East schools will form a new conference and so will CUSA west schools.

Problem solved.

Please don’t take this as me being argumentative because I’m not. I am curious how it will be just that easy to start a new conference? Who pays for the start up fees of said new conference? There are bound to be cost associated with that. What if some of the members don’t want to come along? There only only 7 teams in CUSA East so you’ll need to pick up 3 additional members. If the Sun Belt survives then you can forgot about any of their teams paying an exit fee to come join us. That leaves adding FCS teams and Liberty. Furthermore, who will run this new conference? Will they be better than Judy? What kind of media deal can it get? No one wants this steaming pile of poo that we are in now. We play games on Facebook for crying out loud. Just breaking the same teams into something smaller isn’t going to change that.

I honestly don’t know the answers to these questions, and it seems like an awful lot of unknowns to me. It doesn’t mean that you aren’t 100% correct in your assessment, but that’s a lot of things that have to come together for it to be the same or better than where we are now.

Those are all very good points. And I don't know the answers either. I just don't see the MAC splitting their pie with another mouth to feed when money is driving the bus. We're not the Marshall of old anymore.

I hate to say it because I respect Marshall's program and would like App to share a conference with them, but I agree with this.

Marshall had an incredible run under the MAC banner, with Heisman Trophy contenders, BCS AQ upsets, several championships, and more. Definitely the best five year 1-AA/FCS move up in history.

Then, seemingly pairing with the move to C-USA 2.0, there was a dropoff. Not a complete dropoff, considering Marshall has had a conference championship and several other good seasons, but there has been a drop nonetheless.

What happened that changed the momentum from the late 90's and early 2000's? Was it a coaching change? Was switching to C-USA a jarring step up in competition? Was it just that it is really hard to sustain a run that had great college players like Moss, Pennington, and Leftwich? Some combination?

Academic clearing house rules.

(04-12-2020 08:57 AM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  

(04-11-2020 12:32 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  

(04-11-2020 12:10 AM)GreenBison Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 12:21 PM)HTOWN_HERD Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 11:09 AM)GreenBison Wrote:  If CUSA goes belly up, the remaining schools will just form two small regional confernces. Simple as that. No Exit Fee and No Entrance Fee. I don't understand why people want to over think this. The CUSA East schools will form a new conference and so will CUSA west schools.

Problem solved.

Please don’t take this as me being argumentative because I’m not. I am curious how it will be just that easy to start a new conference? Who pays for the start up fees of said new conference? There are bound to be cost associated with that. What if some of the members don’t want to come along? There only only 7 teams in CUSA East so you’ll need to pick up 3 additional members. If the Sun Belt survives then you can forgot about any of their teams paying an exit fee to come join us. That leaves adding FCS teams and Liberty. Furthermore, who will run this new conference? Will they be better than Judy? What kind of media deal can it get? No one wants this steaming pile of poo that we are in now. We play games on Facebook for crying out loud. Just breaking the same teams into something smaller isn’t going to change that.

I honestly don’t know the answers to these questions, and it seems like an awful lot of unknowns to me. It doesn’t mean that you aren’t 100% correct in your assessment, but that’s a lot of things that have to come together for it to be the same or better than where we are now.

Those are all very good points. And I don't know the answers either. I just don't see the MAC splitting their pie with another mouth to feed when money is driving the bus. We're not the Marshall of old anymore.

I hate to say it because I respect Marshall's program and would like App to share a conference with them, but I agree with this.

Marshall had an incredible run under the MAC banner, with Heisman Trophy contenders, BCS AQ upsets, several championships, and more. Definitely the best five year 1-AA/FCS move up in history.

Then, seemingly pairing with the move to C-USA 2.0, there was a dropoff. Not a complete dropoff, considering Marshall has had a conference championship and several other good seasons, but there has been a drop nonetheless.

What happened that changed the momentum from the late 90's and early 2000's? Was it a coaching change? Was switching to C-USA a jarring step up in competition? Was it just that it is really hard to sustain a run that had great college players like Moss, Pennington, and Leftwich? Some combination?

Academic clearing house rules.

Well part of it was moving up to FBS. Marshall was able to get transfers to play immediately in FCS (Randy Moss). As good as North Dakota St. has been, that last Marshall FCS champ was still probably the best FCS team ever. And they rode that talent for a few years.

(04-07-2020 10:16 AM)Cardiff Wrote:  MAC is not happening.

Sorting through the details won’t be easy. And in the end, Marshall and some others may have to bite the bullet and cough up an exit fee. But one way or the other, I firmly believe that you will see G5 programs realign into a more geographically-coherent arrangement within a decade of now.

The status quo is simply not sustainable, and everyone who is informed, serious, and honest about this, knows it.

I have a feeling the exit fee could be challenged as unreasonable if a member opted to take the conference to court. Nobody has ever paid that much to leave CUSA and considering the media payout is drastically lower than it was when other teams left—there is really no legitimate reason to defend the claim that a loss of 7 million dollars coccus simply because a CUSA member leaves. The truth is, its unlikely the media payout for CUSA would change much even if CUSA’s entire roster were to flip. Thus, there would be little way of defending that 7 million dollar exit fee in court as anything other than punitive as it doesn’t in any way reflect actual legitimate liquidated damages.