(10-02-2021 11:13 AM)VCE Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:00 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 09:33 AM)VCE Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 09:20 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 12:39 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  Since Aresco became commissioner, Notre Dame, Rutgers, Louisville and the C7 left the Big East, and UConn, Cincinnati, UCF and Houston left the AAC. He has overseen more programs leave his conferences than any other conference in NCAA history. That will ultimately be his legacy IMO.

So if Jim Delaney was the AAC commissioner which of that group does he convince to turn down the opportunities they took? If you want to trash him for failing on the MWC thing go ahead I'm doing the same, but this is utter nonsense.

He chased markets rather than brands, completely misunderstanding the tv landscape that was already evolving.

Who was he supposed to go get instead of Tulane, ECU and Tulsa? (And Wichita, later on.) I don't fault him for picking those schools over--who, exactly?

Marshall and Southern Miss? Randy Moss and Brett Favre are long gone and those days aren't coming back. Or to be really specific, those kinds of players are no more likely to come back to Marshall and Southern Miss than to any random FBS school, including Tulane or Tulsa if they throw money at the right coach for a few years.

Anyone with a pulse in the two big sports? Tulane was one of the triggers that led to the C7 departure.

"Anyone with a pulse"
There was nobody better.
Which is why you didn't suggest anybody specific.
There was nobody left worth adding east of I-35

(10-01-2021 10:32 PM)All4One Wrote:  

(10-01-2021 10:25 PM)texoma Wrote:  

(10-01-2021 08:37 PM)All4One Wrote:  

(10-01-2021 07:35 PM)texoma Wrote:  

(10-01-2021 04:44 PM)texoma Wrote:  It hard to believe that any conference commissioner would do that. Isn't that what Bowlsby slammed Aresco for.....torturous interference. Most commissioner's are afraid to talk to individual schools , much less publicly target them. Aresco said he would only talk to schools who expressed an interest in joining the conference. That is to keep conferences from getting sued for tampering.

I would still like to see a link where Dodd said that.

No comment?....no link?

This is the best I can do for you.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...ssion=true

That is not even close to your statement that Thompson named North Texas and Tulsa as his conference's next two if they lost anybody.

Well, that part I'm not sharing because that part isn't public knowledge. What you see there is what the Mountain West felt the public needed to know.

But you said Dodd said it, which he clearly did not. Now you are trying to weasel out of what you said Thompson said. Thompson would never make such a stupid statement. Now you are pretending to have inside info what the MWC is doing. Give it up man, don't be ridiculous.

(10-02-2021 11:17 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:13 AM)VCE Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:00 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 09:33 AM)VCE Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 09:20 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  So if Jim Delaney was the AAC commissioner which of that group does he convince to turn down the opportunities they took? If you want to trash him for failing on the MWC thing go ahead I'm doing the same, but this is utter nonsense.

He chased markets rather than brands, completely misunderstanding the tv landscape that was already evolving.

Who was he supposed to go get instead of Tulane, ECU and Tulsa? (And Wichita, later on.) I don't fault him for picking those schools over--who, exactly?

Marshall and Southern Miss? Randy Moss and Brett Favre are long gone and those days aren't coming back. Or to be really specific, those kinds of players are no more likely to come back to Marshall and Southern Miss than to any random FBS school, including Tulane or Tulsa if they throw money at the right coach for a few years.

Anyone with a pulse in the two big sports? Tulane was one of the triggers that led to the C7 departure.

"Anyone with a pulse"
There was nobody better.
Which is why you didn't suggest anybody specific.
There was nobody left worth adding east of I-35

Southern Miss and NIU were both better back then.

(10-02-2021 11:23 AM)VCE Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:17 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:13 AM)VCE Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:00 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 09:33 AM)VCE Wrote:  He chased markets rather than brands, completely misunderstanding the tv landscape that was already evolving.

Who was he supposed to go get instead of Tulane, ECU and Tulsa? (And Wichita, later on.) I don't fault him for picking those schools over--who, exactly?

Marshall and Southern Miss? Randy Moss and Brett Favre are long gone and those days aren't coming back. Or to be really specific, those kinds of players are no more likely to come back to Marshall and Southern Miss than to any random FBS school, including Tulane or Tulsa if they throw money at the right coach for a few years.

Anyone with a pulse in the two big sports? Tulane was one of the triggers that led to the C7 departure.

"Anyone with a pulse"
There was nobody better.
Which is why you didn't suggest anybody specific.
There was nobody left worth adding east of I-35

Southern Miss and NIU were both better back then.

LOL at the idea the C7 stays if you add 1 of those 2 instead of Tulane, or both instead of ECU. You know that's garbage. The Tulane being the last straw thing has always been garbage. Just the excuse they used to attempt to justify what they were already talking about and planning on doing. If they added Southern Miss they'd have used them as the excuse.

(10-02-2021 11:30 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:23 AM)VCE Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:17 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:13 AM)VCE Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:00 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  Who was he supposed to go get instead of Tulane, ECU and Tulsa? (And Wichita, later on.) I don't fault him for picking those schools over--who, exactly?

Marshall and Southern Miss? Randy Moss and Brett Favre are long gone and those days aren't coming back. Or to be really specific, those kinds of players are no more likely to come back to Marshall and Southern Miss than to any random FBS school, including Tulane or Tulsa if they throw money at the right coach for a few years.

Anyone with a pulse in the two big sports? Tulane was one of the triggers that led to the C7 departure.

"Anyone with a pulse"
There was nobody better.
Which is why you didn't suggest anybody specific.
There was nobody left worth adding east of I-35

Southern Miss and NIU were both better back then.

LOL at the idea the C7 stays if you add 1 of those 2 instead of Tulane, or both instead of ECU. You know that's garbage. The Tulane being the last straw thing has always been garbage. Just the excuse they used to attempt to justify what they were already talking about and planning on doing. If they added Southern Miss they'd have used them as the excuse.

Pretty much. It's not that the C7 wanted (your fave) instead of Tulane. It's that Tulane was terribad and there was nobody much better. Which came out as "Tulane? WTF? Have you seen their RPI?".
Southern Miss, Marshall, UAB, Western Kentucky, UMass, Ohio--the cupboard was bare.

Northern Illinois pretends to bring Chicago, but then DePaul is an issue. On the one hand Villanova swallowed Temple, on the other NIU basketball is not Temple basketball. Wikipedia says NIU football was having a moment in the sun in 2010-12, but I don't remember anyone noticing at the time.

(10-02-2021 09:45 AM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 09:20 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 12:39 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  

(10-01-2021 11:32 PM)Transic_nyc Wrote:  

(10-01-2021 07:31 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  I suspect that even some people who have consistently defended, and even celebrated, the commissioner for the past 9 years are finally seeing the light.

That first AAC contract he did where he traded in $$$ for ESPN exposure wasn't bad, for a conference full of upstarts with aspirations to become bigger. The problem is that strategy can only work until the time programs want to be PAID.

Compare that to what Jim Delany did. Sure, Delany had a lot more to work with than Aresco did. However, Jim made it clear that legacy programs were never going to be paid less than they're worth just to have games shown on the 4-letter monster. Mike's very good putting out word there about the programs in the AAC but he's too much of an elitist to pull off the rebel, upstart stunt in its full effect. If he wanted Big XII programs he had to show them the $$$. For that he needed more than one media partner to spread the wealth around, not promises of "well, you have to show a commitment to my conference if you want to be paid the same or more and then we'll talk $." And that oversight is the one that ended up costing him when Bob Bowlsby cleans his lunchbox. Yes, Bob Bowlsby.

Aresco, like Swofford at the ACC, believed that being in the good graces of Disney is more important than performing his fiduciary duty for the programs. No way would Boise State and San Diego State take a risk with that.

The first contract he negotiated was bad, though. He sold a false bill of goods to the OBE, which the powers that be ate up. It ended up being so radically different than what he pitched that the C7 were encouraged to split and form their own league. To make matters worse, he was hired because of his TV experience and connections. And that provided little financial value to the membership schools, then or now.

He developed the P6 and Americ6nRising mantra. He put stickers on helmets. He put branding on down markers. He created an entire marketing pamphlet arguing that the AAC should be treated and paid like a power conference. Whether it was the departure of UConn, Cincinnati, Houston or UCF, it was always sold as a good thing for the league moving forward. He pumped his chest when the league got a billion dollar deal with ESPN, completely hiding the reality it was a 12-year deal in order to accomplish that. It's no surprise why the terms of the deal were never released after UConn left (Spoiler: it's because it's no longer a billion dollar deal).

Now add this new spin on Air Force and Colorado State. Different tunes, same dance.

Aresco is a salesman, first and foremost,, and a poor one at that. Every time he attempts to spin a situation it is obvious and awkward. Nevertheless, the AAC Presidents are eating what Aresco is cooking (hence his quick extension even after losing members). I'm looking forward to reading his future quotes about added members being "targets from the beginning".

Since Aresco became commissioner, Notre Dame, Rutgers, Louisville and the C7 left the Big East, and UConn, Cincinnati, UCF and Houston left the AAC. He has overseen more programs leave his conferences than any other conference in NCAA history. That will ultimately be his legacy IMO.

So if Jim Delaney was the AAC commissioner which of that group does he convince to turn down the opportunities they took? If you want to trash him for failing on the MWC thing go ahead I'm doing the same, but this is utter nonsense.

lulz, yea think of all of those teams that seriously moved down in conference affiliation to get away from Aresco's AAC.

I mean, how could Aresco not hold onto Rutgers and allowed them to move to the B1G?

It's the same reason why Miami left for the ACC. The administration at these universities want to join the ACC and BIG10 for research dollars and academic prestige.

(10-02-2021 11:30 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:23 AM)VCE Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:17 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:13 AM)VCE Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:00 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  Who was he supposed to go get instead of Tulane, ECU and Tulsa? (And Wichita, later on.) I don't fault him for picking those schools over--who, exactly?

Marshall and Southern Miss? Randy Moss and Brett Favre are long gone and those days aren't coming back. Or to be really specific, those kinds of players are no more likely to come back to Marshall and Southern Miss than to any random FBS school, including Tulane or Tulsa if they throw money at the right coach for a few years.

Anyone with a pulse in the two big sports? Tulane was one of the triggers that led to the C7 departure.

"Anyone with a pulse"
There was nobody better.
Which is why you didn't suggest anybody specific.
There was nobody left worth adding east of I-35

Southern Miss and NIU were both better back then.

LOL at the idea the C7 stays if you add 1 of those 2 instead of Tulane, or both instead of ECU. You know that's garbage. The Tulane being the last straw thing has always been garbage. Just the excuse they used to attempt to justify what they were already talking about and planning on doing. If they added Southern Miss they'd have used them as the excuse.

I was using those two schools as examples that would have been better for the AAC going forward rather than chasing markets.

There was a C7 AD quoted at the time, maybe Marquette’s?, who said the Tulane add was the final straw. I agree we would have left eventually anyway.

(10-02-2021 11:22 AM)texoma Wrote:  

(10-01-2021 10:32 PM)All4One Wrote:  

(10-01-2021 10:25 PM)texoma Wrote:  

(10-01-2021 08:37 PM)All4One Wrote:  

(10-01-2021 07:35 PM)texoma Wrote:  No comment?....no link?

This is the best I can do for you.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...ssion=true

That is not even close to your statement that Thompson named North Texas and Tulsa as his conference's next two if they lost anybody.

Well, that part I'm not sharing because that part isn't public knowledge. What you see there is what the Mountain West felt the public needed to know.

But you said Dodd said it, which he clearly did not. Now you are trying to weasel out of what you said Thompson said. Thompson would never make such a stupid statement. Now you are pretending to have inside info what the MWC is doing. Give it up man, don't be ridiculous.

Okay.

(10-02-2021 11:13 AM)VCE Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:00 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 09:33 AM)VCE Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 09:20 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 12:39 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  Since Aresco became commissioner, Notre Dame, Rutgers, Louisville and the C7 left the Big East, and UConn, Cincinnati, UCF and Houston left the AAC. He has overseen more programs leave his conferences than any other conference in NCAA history. That will ultimately be his legacy IMO.

So if Jim Delaney was the AAC commissioner which of that group does he convince to turn down the opportunities they took? If you want to trash him for failing on the MWC thing go ahead I'm doing the same, but this is utter nonsense.

He chased markets rather than brands, completely misunderstanding the tv landscape that was already evolving.

Who was he supposed to go get instead of Tulane, ECU and Tulsa? (And Wichita, later on.) I don't fault him for picking those schools over--who, exactly?

Marshall and Southern Miss? Randy Moss and Brett Favre are long gone and those days aren't coming back. Or to be really specific, those kinds of players are no more likely to come back to Marshall and Southern Miss than to any random FBS school, including Tulane or Tulsa if they throw money at the right coach for a few years.

Anyone with a pulse in the two big sports? Tulane was one of the triggers that led to the C7 departure.

This is a false narrative. Tulane was chosen by the Catholic schools.

(10-02-2021 11:49 AM)VCE Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:30 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:23 AM)VCE Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:17 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:13 AM)VCE Wrote:  Anyone with a pulse in the two big sports? Tulane was one of the triggers that led to the C7 departure.

"Anyone with a pulse"
There was nobody better.
Which is why you didn't suggest anybody specific.
There was nobody left worth adding east of I-35

Southern Miss and NIU were both better back then.

LOL at the idea the C7 stays if you add 1 of those 2 instead of Tulane, or both instead of ECU. You know that's garbage. The Tulane being the last straw thing has always been garbage. Just the excuse they used to attempt to justify what they were already talking about and planning on doing. If they added Southern Miss they'd have used them as the excuse.

I was using those two schools as examples that would have been better for the AAC going forward rather than chasing markets.

There was a C7 AD quoted at the time, maybe Marquette’s?, who said the Tulane add was the final straw. I agree we would have left eventually anyway.

It was (our former athletic director, Larry Williams). His full quotes are below. Not all ADs were consulted on additions, and the Presidents were sold stabilized television revenues under next TV deal with major markets being added. It was either a gross miscalculation or a blatant lie. In either case, it was a driving factor in the C7 to finally separate.

To be clear - the addition of Tulane did not push the C7 out. It was the false promise of recouped television revenues via new members because of their respective markets (and certainly not brand value). It's why the C7 grew concerned with direction of the league and why they pursued alternative affiliations.

https://www.espn.com/blog/collegebasketb...e-addition

I see the ACC and the AAC in the same position. Both leagues are losing their bell cows. With the ACC it is due to Clemson and FSU coming back to Earth. With the AAC it is theirs are jumping ship.

This presents opportunities to the rest of both leagues. Who will step up and be that next great team? I can remember UCF and Memphis being dreadful a decade or so ago. There was a time when Cinci was 0-7 or 0-8 against Pitt all time. Va Tech was awful before joining the Big East. On the other side, USF had a head start on UCF but they didn't rise to the occasion.

In both cases, the help isn't coming from outside. It is up to the current members to step up and become the next flagship. For the AAC you do have an opportunity to pick up teams that:

1. Have the potential.
2. have the desire and institutional commitment to excellence.

Choose wisely.

(10-02-2021 01:21 PM)Shannon Panther Wrote:  I see the ACC and the AAC in the same position. Both leagues are losing their bell cows. With the ACC it is due to Clemson and FSU coming back to Earth. With the AAC it is theirs are jumping ship.

This presents opportunities to the rest of both leagues. Who will step up and be that next great team? I can remember UCF and Memphis being dreadful a decade or so ago. There was a time when Cinci was 0-7 or 0-8 against Pitt all time. Va Tech was awful before joining the Big East. On the other side, USF had a head start on UCF but they didn't rise to the occasion.

In both cases, the help isn't coming from outside. It is up to the current members to step up and become the next flagship. For the AAC you do have an opportunity to pick up teams that:

1. Have the potential.
2. have the desire and institutional commitment to excellence.

Choose wisely.

Well put overall.

(10-02-2021 12:32 PM)All4One Wrote:  

(10-02-2021 11:22 AM)texoma Wrote:  

(10-01-2021 10:32 PM)All4One Wrote:  

(10-01-2021 10:25 PM)texoma Wrote:  

(10-01-2021 08:37 PM)All4One Wrote:  This is the best I can do for you.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...ssion=true

That is not even close to your statement that Thompson named North Texas and Tulsa as his conference's next two if they lost anybody.

Well, that part I'm not sharing because that part isn't public knowledge. What you see there is what the Mountain West felt the public needed to know.

But you said Dodd said it, which he clearly did not. Now you are trying to weasel out of what you said Thompson said. Thompson would never make such a stupid statement. Now you are pretending to have inside info what the MWC is doing. Give it up man, don't be ridiculous.

Okay.

We are good....you are a big man.