(11-02-2022 05:35 PM)Poster Wrote:  Have they not learned from the Big East about how having basketball only members of a conference doesn’t work?

Most of them were a lot better back then than they are now.

BYU is Gonzaga's partner in the WCC, so not that strange. The new Big 12 could be a basketball powerhouse.

I can also see how that might make it more enticing for Arizona.

(11-02-2022 05:46 PM)Porcine Wrote:  

(11-02-2022 05:35 PM)Poster Wrote:  Have they not learned from the Big East about how having basketball only members of a conference doesn’t work?

Most of them were a lot better back then than they are now.

The basketball school/football school tensions eventually lead to every single original football school leaving. (Except for Temple, who was kicked out but let back in.)


And a year later the basketball schools left the conference themselves.

I don't see this different than a ND situation. They don't need another BBall only partner. Travel partners would be nice, but they don't exist for Zaga outside the PAC10.

(11-02-2022 05:52 PM)RUScarlets Wrote:  I don't see this different than a ND situation. They don't need another BBall only partner. Travel partners would be nice, but they don't exist for Zaga outside the PAC10.

ND plays 5 ACC teams a year, and is tied to the ACC bowls. This is more analogous to the 1993-2012 Big East.

(11-02-2022 05:08 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  If this happens (lots of if) ...

1. It would be huge for both Gonzaga and the Big 12. What a monster men's hoops league.

2. It might open the door for the Big 12 to also add either Creighton or UConn (for all sports but football) so as to have 14 basketball programs.

This could be very interesting to follow.

UConn is already in the Big East in basketball.


I can’t imagine that the Big 12 would be able to get UConn basketball without taking UConn football. And I can’t imagine the Big 12 taking UConn football. So I can’t see UConn to the Big 12 possibly happening.

(11-02-2022 05:11 PM)Huan Wrote:  UConn would make sense if the b12 builds a pod east, west, plains and Texas

(11-02-2022 05:36 PM)bullet Wrote:  I just really don't see the need for the Big 12.

And hybrid members kind of tag you as lesser.

The money is really in football.

I actually agree with you for a change.
It does not make a lot of sense for the Big 12. They have a strong basketball conference and they don't need to fly out to Spokane for Olympic sports. The money really is in football.

For the Pac-12, it may be a move they would have to make to replace UCLA basketball. If you are going to add a hybrid, there is not a better choice than Gonzaga. The Pac-12 will need San Diego State and Gonzaga for other Olympic sports as well, such as men's soccer and women's lacrosse. But who knows, maybe the PAC will agree that the "hybrid members kind of tag you as a lesser." We will see.

uConn has burned too many bridges, IMO.

Can't see UC, UCF, or Houston getting on board to add the Pound Puppies after the way uConn treated them and I think they would be a hard sell to the other B12 members.

(11-02-2022 04:08 PM)Maize Wrote:  Notre Dame is a partial member in the ACC … increase the NCAA Basketball Credits

Notre Dame is a full member of the ACC, with football as a carve-out. All its other sports compete in the ACC where the conference offers championships in.

This is not unlike when Miami was a full member of the Big East but intentionally did not play baseball in the conference to protect its standing.

To me, this move would make little sense for the Big 12. yormark needs to play the long game. Eventually the Big 10 and SEC will expand again and the Big 12 will be there to try and unite the Pac 10 and ACC remnants. Gonzaga is an undue complication in the pursuit of that end game.

(11-02-2022 06:02 PM)Poster Wrote:  

(11-02-2022 05:08 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  If this happens (lots of if) ...

1. It would be huge for both Gonzaga and the Big 12. What a monster men's hoops league.

2. It might open the door for the Big 12 to also add either Creighton or UConn (for all sports but football) so as to have 14 basketball programs.

This could be very interesting to follow.

UConn is already in the Big East in basketball.


I can’t imagine that the Big 12 would be able to get UConn basketball without taking UConn football. And I can’t imagine the Big 12 taking UConn football. So I can’t see UConn to the Big 12 possibly happening.

I would be opposed to it, but I could see a scheduling agreement where UConn plays 3 Big 12 teams a year in football on a home and home basis going through the league in 4 years.

(11-02-2022 05:35 PM)Poster Wrote:  Have they not learned from the Big East about how having basketball only members of a conference doesn’t work?

The Big East had no basketball-only members.

(11-02-2022 04:52 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(11-02-2022 04:50 PM)RUScarlets Wrote:  

(11-02-2022 04:47 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(11-02-2022 04:41 PM)Milwaukee Wrote:  

(11-02-2022 04:21 PM)ArmoredUpKnight Wrote:  

Not "crushing," but it might be somewhat deflating to their esteem.

However, talks with the Big XII are just that - - "talks."

There's nothing to prevent the PAC from picking up the phone and talking to Gonzaga, as well.

Think about it - - if you were Gonzaga, would you rather compete in the Big XII, which would involve flying to Cincinnati, UCF, WVU, and the Great Plains (2-3 time zones away), or would you rather compete in the PAC, which is in the same region?

My guess is that talking to the Big XII might have the effect of prompting the PAC into offering Gonzaga a spot in the Pacific conference.

Only thing is that the basketball in the Big 12 is so far ahead of Pac it's not funny. And that's even with Oregon and Arizona in the fold for the Pac. If either/both left the Pac- it's even worse.

If you're the PAC, I think you grab Zaga without a doubt with SDSU. Hawaii as a partner can come in at 1/4 share. They'd take it. Zaga could take at least 1/4 or 1/2 share. SDSU could potentially take a 1/4 share if the PAC can get upwards of 35-40 million.

I get why the Pac would do it, but not Gonzaga.

Gonzaga would join the PAC because:

1. The PAC would pay them as much as the Big XII would, and the travel distances in the Big XII would be excessive (requiring travel across 4 time zones).

2. They could dominate the PAC, but not the Big XII. The key to their success has been the fact that they have dominated the WCC, and they could continue to dominate in the PAC - - but not in the Big XII.

Why stop with Gonzaga? The Big 12 should add several more basketball only schools and become a true hybrid conference. They could have a basketball only wing and a football wing. That’s a no fail model.

(11-02-2022 06:02 PM)Poster Wrote:  

(11-02-2022 05:08 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  If this happens (lots of if) ...

1. It would be huge for both Gonzaga and the Big 12. What a monster men's hoops league.

2. It might open the door for the Big 12 to also add either Creighton or UConn (for all sports but football) so as to have 14 basketball programs.

This could be very interesting to follow.

UConn is already in the Big East in basketball.


I can’t imagine that the Big 12 would be able to get UConn basketball without taking UConn football. And I can’t imagine the Big 12 taking UConn football. So I can’t see UConn to the Big 12 possibly happening.

The question for UConn is simple: How are big-time college athletics going to look in the long-term future (and perhaps the near future)?

If Gonzaga makes the move to the Big 12 (again, a big "if"), it will be the latest example of a "consolidation of brands" (which JRsec has effectively assessed in various posts) following OUT and USCLA. UConn — just like Gonzaga and a handful of "brand" programs that are not members of a P5 league — would have to give SERIOUS thought to joining (again, for all sports except football if that's what the Big 12 wants) the Big 12, which will go from being loaded in men's hoops to even more loaded if GU joins. UConn is already a football indy, so no change there.

So to answer the question: How are big-time college athletics going to look in the long-term future?

Answer: Dominated by a likely three to four (max) leagues with a significant number of brands.

If it can work for both sides then hell yes add the Zags to the B12. Brands, brands, brands...especially when Zona joins.

(11-02-2022 06:08 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  To me, this move would make little sense for the Big 12. yormark needs to play the long game. Eventually the Big 10 and SEC will expand again and the Big 12 will be there to try and unite the Pac 10 and ACC remnants. Gonzaga is an undue complication in the pursuit of that end game.

There's go guarantee this will happen and dealing with the ACC can't realistically happen until the middle of the 2030s.

Let me wait for 10 years down the line when I can make a move to improve my conference right now???

(11-02-2022 05:46 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  BYU is Gonzaga's partner in the WCC, so not that strange. The new Big 12 could be a basketball powerhouse.

I can also see how that might make it more enticing for Arizona.

The new Big 12 IS a basketball powerhouse.

final 4s
2008 Kansas champ
2010 West Virginia
2012 Kansas runnerup
2016 Oklahoma*
2018 Kansas
2019 Texas Tech runnerup
2020 No tourney, but Kansas was #1 and Baylor #5 in the final poll
2021 Baylor champ, Houston
2022 Kansas champ

Adding Gonzagas 2 final 4s would be nice, but not that important.

If I were Gonzaga and I didn't expect the B1G to raid the Pac-12 in 5-7 years, I would join the Pac-12.
Otherwise, I would join the Big 12.