How many athletic departments have all five major men's teams sports (FBS football, basketball, baseball, hockey, soccer)?

The answer is 12.

Boston College
UConn
UMass
Notre Dame
Michigan
Michigan State
Ohio State
Penn State
Army
Air Force
Western Michigan
Bowling Green

Mostly names you would expect except for the last two.

FCS programs that have the other four sports:

Yale
Harvard
Princeton
Dartmouth
Brown
Cornell
Holy Cross
Maine
Sacred Heart
St. Thomas
LIU
Merrimack
Stonehill
Lindenwood

(01-09-2023 11:37 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  How many athletic departments have all five major men's teams sports (FBS football, basketball, baseball, hockey, soccer)?

The answer is 12.

Boston College
UConn
UMass
Notre Dame
Michigan
Michigan State
Ohio State
Penn State
Army
Air Force
Western Michigan
Bowling Green

Mostly names you would expect except for the last two.

FCS programs that have the other four sports:

Yale
Harvard
Princeton
Dartmouth
Brown
Cornell
Holy Cross
Maine
Sacred Heart
St. Thomas
LIU
Merrimack
Stonehill
Lindenwood

Why does that shock you?? Just a tad bit of googling would have told you WMU and BG have been playing hockey for decades now with more trips and National Championships than UCONN.

Can you really call hockey a major sport when only 40 D1 schools participate?

I wish the SEC would raise their teams to the NCAA level and put their cash flow behind the programs. I can't imagine how the sport would flourish across the country instead of being a regional sport.

(01-10-2023 12:48 AM)unalions Wrote:  Can you really call hockey a major sport when only 40 D1 schools participate?

I wish the SEC would raise their teams to the NCAA level and put their cash flow behind the programs. I can't imagine how the sport would flourish across the country instead of being a regional sport.

Guess it depends on how you define it. Of the D1 schools that play college hockey, most have better attendance than their basketball programs and it's one of the few NCAA tournaments that actually generates a profit. I'd love to see Georgia add the sport, with their new arena that is being built. Would be interesting to see if they could replicate the fan support that ASU has so quickly built.

(01-10-2023 01:26 AM)nodak651 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 12:48 AM)unalions Wrote:  Can you really call hockey a major sport when only 40 D1 schools participate?

I wish the SEC would raise their teams to the NCAA level and put their cash flow behind the programs. I can't imagine how the sport would flourish across the country instead of being a regional sport.

Guess it depends on how you define it. Of the D1 schools that play college hockey, most have better attendance than their basketball programs and it's one of the few NCAA tournaments that actually generates a profit. I'd love to see Georgia add the sport, with their new arena that is being built. Would be interesting to see if they could replicate the fan support that ASU has so quickly built.

Some, but probably not most.

(01-10-2023 03:47 AM)Todor Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 01:26 AM)nodak651 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 12:48 AM)unalions Wrote:  Can you really call hockey a major sport when only 40 D1 schools participate?

I wish the SEC would raise their teams to the NCAA level and put their cash flow behind the programs. I can't imagine how the sport would flourish across the country instead of being a regional sport.

Guess it depends on how you define it. Of the D1 schools that play college hockey, most have better attendance than their basketball programs and it's one of the few NCAA tournaments that actually generates a profit. I'd love to see Georgia add the sport, with their new arena that is being built. Would be interesting to see if they could replicate the fan support that ASU has so quickly built.

Some, but probably not most.

I count 29 of 42. Data from this season, as of today.
https://www.uscho.com/stats/attendance/d...2022-2023/
https://stats.ncaa.org/rankings?sport_co...division=1

22-23 Average Attendance
Hockey Basketball
North Dakota 11,253 1,405
Minnesota 8,538 8,817
Wisconsin 7,383 14,200
Boston College 7,077 4,392
Omaha 6,184 2,504
Penn State 6,009 5,932
Michigan 5,683 11,960
Denver 5,678 1,083
Michigan State 5,438 14,797
Notre Dame 4,689 5,762
Massachusetts 4,465 3,662
UMass Lowell 4,424 677
New Hampshire 4,317 554
Harvard 2,139 1,281
BU 4,276 837
Arizona State 4,104 7,088
Ohio State 4,092 11,591
Cornell 3,524 577
WMU 3,288 1,374
Connecticut 3,111 10,182
Quinnipiac 3,049 1,003
Northeastern 3,027 884
Maine 2,833 890
Bowling Green 2,558 1,616
Vermont 2,530 2,122
Merrimack 2,516 1,286
Providence 2,480 9,612
Yale 1,775 881
Princeton 1,733 1,349
Miami 1,710 1,563
Air Force 1,662 1,258
Lindenwood 1,569 978
Dartmouth 1,543 544
Army 1,454 673
Colgate 808 789
Sacred Heart 796 567
St. Thomas 760 1,018
Brown 758 618
Canisius 708 1,073
Niagara 618 866
LIU 472 396
Holy Cross 419 1,043

Nodak, you were definitely right! I had no idea so many schools in that group had such low basketball attendance.

Track and Gymnastics should replace Hockey and Soccer

(01-10-2023 07:22 AM)Todor Wrote:  Nodak, you were definitely right! I had no idea so many schools in that group had such low basketball attendance.

Baseball attendance is even lower. In Bowling Green, a crowd of 300 is typical.

(01-10-2023 12:48 AM)unalions Wrote:  Can you really call hockey a major sport when only 40 D1 schools participate?

I'm not sure most people consider hockey a major college sport.

but on the other hand, it has a pulse. I would be suprised if the NCAA mens soccer finals get similar ratings to the College World Series and Frozen Four games.

The big difference is, you don't have 200-250 college hockey programs with near-zero interest bringing the average down.

Quote:I wish the SEC would raise their teams to the NCAA level and put their cash flow behind the programs. I can't imagine how the sport would flourish across the country instead of being a regional sport.

I can very much see the other side though--the SEC markets aren't good hockey markets. If you want to reallocate some SEC money, especially in the age of NIL, pump up SEC baseball to make it more competitive with the minor league draft. I know if I were a 17 year old jock, I'd rather spend 3 years in Tuscaloosa or Lexington or Starksville on a campus full of college girls than 3 years in Hickory or Asheville or Wilmington as a minor league ballplayer.

Hockey is a clear #3 in revenue.

(01-09-2023 11:37 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  FCS programs that have the other four sports:

Yale
Harvard
Princeton
Dartmouth
Brown
Cornell
Holy Cross
Maine
Sacred Heart
St. Thomas
LIU
Merrimack
Stonehill
Lindenwood

Maine does not sponsor men's soccer.

Are soccer and hockey even major sports if their championships are on espnu and espn2 respectively?

(01-10-2023 09:18 AM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  Are soccer and hockey even major sports if their championships are on espnu and espn2 respectively?

Seems kind of arbitrary.

(01-09-2023 11:37 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  How many athletic departments have all five major men's teams sports (FBS football, basketball, baseball, hockey, soccer)?

The answer is 12.

Boston College
UConn
UMass
Notre Dame
Michigan
Michigan State
Ohio State
Penn State
Army
Air Force
Western Michigan
Bowling Green

Mostly names you would expect except for the last two.

FCS programs that have the other four sports:

Yale
Harvard
Princeton
Dartmouth
Brown
Cornell
Holy Cross
Maine
Sacred Heart
St. Thomas
LIU
Merrimack
Stonehill
Lindenwood

LIU joined that list by combining with the Post campus in Nassau County for sports. That's where football and the new hockey team play. Unfortunately, they got rid of the awesome Blackbirds nickname and black/white scheme.

Hockey is entirely regional. I don't know a single hockey fan or even casual player even though I share a state with a recently successful pro team. The other 4 are pretty universal.

(01-10-2023 10:05 AM)Titans3775 Wrote:  Hockey is entirely regional. I don't know a single hockey fan or even casual player even though I share a state with a recently successful pro team. The other 4 are pretty universal.

Would you include lacrosse instead?

(01-10-2023 08:42 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 12:48 AM)unalions Wrote:  Can you really call hockey a major sport when only 40 D1 schools participate?

I'm not sure most people consider hockey a major college sport.

but on the other hand, it has a pulse. I would be suprised if the NCAA mens soccer finals get similar ratings to the College World Series and Frozen Four games.

The big difference is, you don't have 200-250 college hockey programs with near-zero interest bringing the average down.

Right - I think the point is that you can't just be "halfway in" to have a hockey program with the expenses and facilities required. It's a major specific commitment to have hockey, whereas everyone has basketball regardless of interest level.

So, at a micro-level, hockey is considered a major college sport at most of the individual schools where it's actually sponsored.

The smaller number of total D-I hockey schools also, by extension, makes everyone from the largest athletic departments in the Big Ten down to the MAC schools down to the small private schools have much more even competitiveness-wise in hockey compared to the P5 vs. everyone else dichotomy in virtually every other sport (even beyond football and basketball). This means that the *relative* power that every D-I hockey school has within that sport is the equivalent of being a P5 school in football, so the relative interest in hockey at all of those schools (particularly non-P5 schools) is going to be higher (e.g. when you're a power school in hockey but a mid-major/low-major in basketball, the interest is naturally going to flow more to hockey).

However, at a macro-level, hockey isn't a major college sport nationally. You could argue that hockey has a large presence regionally in places like New England and the Midwest. However, you can't have entire swaths of the country like California, Texas and Florida not having D-I programs and argue that it's a national sport.

In contrast, basketball is universally played by everyone, which means that it's going to have a wide range from NBA-level attendance at the top level down to barely anyone in the stands at the bottom level. As noted above, every D-I hockey school *feels* like a power school in that sport because there are so few programs at that level, whereas basketball has the P5 plus Big East/high-major/mid-major/low-major class structure.

College baseball is entirely regional as well.

Personally I'd wish WMU would drop baseball & bring men's Cross Country & Track back. Seems like they'd be cheaper + baseball always playing in the south. The MAC used to require it but Akron (or Kent, can't remember) dropped it a few years ago then recently brought it back.

(01-10-2023 09:49 AM)nodak651 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 09:18 AM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  Are soccer and hockey even major sports if their championships are on espnu and espn2 respectively?

Seems kind of arbitrary.

The point being that if the championships are on those channels then there is not much of a following and so they are not "major" sports in college athletics .