(08-12-2023 09:24 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 09:13 PM)msu35 Wrote:  Okay, let's be clear here. Making definitive statements like claiming it will triple travel costs is a bit absurd. It's your opinion. I gave you some data that actually showed how travel to a school further away could actually cost less. See, this wasn't opinion. It was fact. If you can't quantify the claim of triple the cost, it's irresponsible to throw that around as if it was indeed factual.

It seems that you're against a merger with the AAC. That's fine. I personally see it as the most logical pathway from a cost/benefit perspective.

Its a fact on one flight--at one moment in time. Its quite a leap to say that one instance available today means that an athletic department can replicate that when reserving a years worth of flights arranged around a conference schedule when the distances involved will double to triple over previous years.

Im not against a Pac-4/AAC merger. Im not against a Pac4/MW merger. I just dont think either are what will eventually happen. In the end, I think the Pac4's academics first mind set will cause them to rebuild a 8-to-10 team conference comprised with schools the Pac4 views as academic peers. I just gave you a way they might be able to fashion an Pac4/AAC that would be acceptable to the Pac4 academic snobery---but it has down sides for some current members of the AAC.

It's more facts than you've provided. Do you realize that flying into a major city is almost always cheaper than flying into small airports, even if they're much closer? Have you also considered that small towns often don't even have direct flights, mandating other means of transit to get from the airport to the school? We could go on and on. You know what else is a fact? The fact that you have yet to be able to quantify and back up the claim of triple the travel expenditures. Keep deflecting.

(08-12-2023 09:39 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 09:24 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 09:13 PM)msu35 Wrote:  Okay, let's be clear here. Making definitive statements like claiming it will triple travel costs is a bit absurd. It's your opinion. I gave you some data that actually showed how travel to a school further away could actually cost less. See, this wasn't opinion. It was fact. If you can't quantify the claim of triple the cost, it's irresponsible to throw that around as if it was indeed factual.

It seems that you're against a merger with the AAC. That's fine. I personally see it as the most logical pathway from a cost/benefit perspective.

Its a fact on one flight--at one moment in time. Its quite a leap to say that one instance available today means that an athletic department can replicate that when reserving a years worth of flights arranged around a conference schedule when the distances involved will double to triple over previous years.

Im not against a Pac-4/AAC merger. Im not against a Pac4/MW merger. I just dont think either are what will eventually happen. In the end, I think the Pac4's academics first mind set will cause them to rebuild a 8-to-10 team conference comprised with schools the Pac4 views as academic peers. I just gave you a way they might be able to fashion an Pac4/AAC that would be acceptable to the Pac4 academic snobery---but it has down sides for some current members of the AAC.

It's more facts than you've provided. Do you realize that flying into a major city is almost always cheaper than flying into small airports, even if they're much closer? Have you also considered that small towns often don't even have direct flights, mandating other means of transit to get from the airport to the school? We could go on and on. You know what else is a fact? The fact that you have yet to be able to quantify and back up the claim of triple the travel expenditures. Keep deflecting.

This is an example of increased costs from when ODU jumped to CUSA. Its kind of outlines what happens to athletics travel spending when the footprint is stretched. The CAA is tighter than the Pac12, but going to a Pac4/AAC footprint will be stretching a similar 1500 to 2000 extra miles over the current Pac12 footprint.


https://www.pilotonline.com/2016/01/16/m...andidates/

Doing so could save some real cash. ODU’s travel budget nearly doubled when it left the Colonial Athletic Association for C-USA – from $2.2 million in 2012-2013 to $4.1 million this school year. Travel now represents about 10 percent of ODU’s overall athletic spending.

The football team spent $194,690 on lodging, meals and travel for a trip to San Antonio this past season. A year earlier, the Monarchs spent nearly $500,000 combined on two road trips – to Rice and UTEP.

Those games came right after the Monarchs spent $33,267 to bus to a game at North Carolina State.

In all, ODU spent about $1.4 million on football travel this past season, nearly three times what the Monarchs spent in the CAA. And it’s not just football that’s spending more. Everyone’s budgets increased. Travel costs for women’s basketball –$192,905 in 2012-2013 – were projected to grow to $464,002 this season.

The problem here is the great distance teams must travel to get to many C-USA cities. UTEP and ODU are 2,000 miles apart.

(08-12-2023 09:07 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 08:23 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 08:19 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 08:01 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 07:56 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  One of the two conferences will disappear when a merger occurs. You either move forward as the Pac12---or the AAC (not both--there wont be 2 autobids).

Correct. It will be the AAC merging with the PAC, preserving the PAC for the aforementioned benefits. To do otherwise would never be in consideration by any party.

(08-12-2023 07:56 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  If you choose the Pac12---you do get to keep the Pac12 NCAA credits and the CFP P5 sized payout. However, the AAC NCAA credits revert to the original teams that earned them---and many of those credits would be gone (credits earned by UConn, Houston, and Cinci for instance).

A very easy decision, I assure you.

(08-12-2023 07:56 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  Furthermore, these credits and payouts are now spread over 20 teams---not just 10---so the effect is a 50% cut in the amount these revenue streams produce for the Pac4 teams.

Avoiding the barrier of eight-figure exit fees for every team you bring in, bypassing the negotiations required with so many individual programs, resolving things quickly, and getting a bump from ESPN makes this all very easy to justify.

(08-12-2023 07:56 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  So yes---Im thinking things through.

I was hoping you were going to tell me something new. Furthermore, you avoided the most interesting claim. How would it triple travel expenditures?

Have you looked at map? SMU is over 2000 miles from Oregon St---and thats one of the closest AAC schools. From OSU to New Orleans is over 2500 miles. Im not even using the really far ones. OSU to Temple is about 2900 miles. OSU to USF is almost 3100 miles. For comparison, the distance from Stanford to Boulder Colorado is 1200 miles. The distance from Stanford to WSU is 900 miles. The distance from Stanford to SDSU is 485 miles. So yeah---double to triple the travel costs sounds about right.
L

Sounds like nonsense and excuses. I just tested this. I mocked up two flights from Eugene, OR. One to Colorado Springs, CO and the other to Dallas, TX. Guess what? The flight to Colorado cost $342 and the flight to Dallas cost $339. Imagine that!

I dont think that is a pattern that would hold up consistently---especially when the difference in travel distances become wider. One thing I will say that I mentioned in another thread---there is one Pac4/AAC divisional configuration that offers relatively reasonable travel and places the Pac4 in an academic bubble they could probably stomach.

AAC West

Stanford
Cal
OSU
WSU
Tulsa
SMU
Rice
Tulane
Navy

Rest of the AAC, including N Texas and UTSA are in the east. The Pac4 live in a conference bubble with their academic peers and the travel distances are similar to the rebuilt Pac10 conference I proposed (except the shorter trips to SDSU and Air Force are missing). The Pac4 are still taking a substantial hit to their "other" revenue sources like CFP and NCAA credits due to the bloated nature of the merger---but it does give the Pac4 some of what they would get from a Pac4 rebuild. The problem with this configuration is it screws over existing AAC members UTSA and N Texas pretty badly and it also means that there are no crossover football games between divisions because the AAC promised Navy the AAC would never exceed an 8 game schedule. The divisional arrangement would probably need to be utilized for basketball too (as well some non-revenue sports like soccer, volleyball, womens basketball, softball, etc).

Stanford will never ever allow Tulsa into their conference. Their academics is below Boise State. They have been cutting degrees in certain areas to save money. With how many students enrolled? They don't have enough to offer many degrees right now.

(08-12-2023 09:53 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  This is an example of increased costs from when ODU jumped to CUSA. Its kind of outlines what happens when the footprint is stretched. The CAA is tighter than the Pac12, but an Pac4/AAC footprint will be stretching a similar 1500 to 2000 extra miles over its current footprint.


https://www.pilotonline.com/2016/01/16/m...andidates/

Doing so could save some real cash. ODU’s travel budget nearly doubled when it left the Colonial Athletic Association for C-USA – from $2.2 million in 2012-2013 to $4.1 million this school year. Travel now represents about 10 percent of ODU’s overall athletic spending.

The football team spent $194,690 on lodging, meals and travel for a trip to San Antonio this past season. A year earlier, the Monarchs spent nearly $500,000 combined on two road trips – to Rice and UTEP.

Those games came right after the Monarchs spent $33,267 to bus to a game at North Carolina State.

In all, ODU spent about $1.4 million on football travel this past season, nearly three times what the Monarchs spent in the CAA. And it’s not just football that’s spending more. Everyone’s budgets increased. Travel costs for women’s basketball –$192,905 in 2012-2013 – were projected to grow to $464,002 this season.

The problem here is the great distance teams must travel to get to many C-USA cities. UTEP and ODU are 2,000 miles apart.

That's a comparison of the cost of busing versus flying. Let me give you some information. I don't know how much time you've spent out West, but I typically vacation out West for a month at a time. Nothing, and I mean nothing, is terribly close to anything else. Almost all of the travel will involve flying for the PAC schools. Apples to oranges.

If you cared about being honest, you would have quoted this:

Quote:Georgia State is far removed from the league’s four Texas schools, but Atlanta’s hub airport is a direct flight away.

(08-12-2023 09:59 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 09:53 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  This is an example of increased costs from when ODU jumped to CUSA. Its kind of outlines what happens when the footprint is stretched. The CAA is tighter than the Pac12, but an Pac4/AAC footprint will be stretching a similar 1500 to 2000 extra miles over its current footprint.


https://www.pilotonline.com/2016/01/16/m...andidates/

Doing so could save some real cash. ODU’s travel budget nearly doubled when it left the Colonial Athletic Association for C-USA – from $2.2 million in 2012-2013 to $4.1 million this school year. Travel now represents about 10 percent of ODU’s overall athletic spending.

The football team spent $194,690 on lodging, meals and travel for a trip to San Antonio this past season. A year earlier, the Monarchs spent nearly $500,000 combined on two road trips – to Rice and UTEP.

Those games came right after the Monarchs spent $33,267 to bus to a game at North Carolina State.

In all, ODU spent about $1.4 million on football travel this past season, nearly three times what the Monarchs spent in the CAA. And it’s not just football that’s spending more. Everyone’s budgets increased. Travel costs for women’s basketball –$192,905 in 2012-2013 – were projected to grow to $464,002 this season.

The problem here is the great distance teams must travel to get to many C-USA cities. UTEP and ODU are 2,000 miles apart.

That's a comparison of the cost of busing versus flying. Let me give you some information. I don't know how much time you've spent out West, but I typically vacation out West for a month at a time. Nothing, and I mean nothing, is terribly close to anything else. Almost all of the travel will involve flying for the PAC schools. Apples to oranges.

If you cared about being honest, you would have quoted this:

Quote:Georgia State is far removed from the league’s four Texas schools, but Atlanta’s hub airport is a direct flight away.

Why would you think that quote is at all significant? I never said it was difficult to get to far away AAC schools. I said it was more expensive. Now who's deflecting? Ive given you facts. Ive given you distances. Ive given you actual numbers from an athletic department that went through a stretching of its conference footprint. Like I said before, we will just have to agree to disagree.

(08-12-2023 10:13 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 09:59 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 09:53 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  This is an example of increased costs from when ODU jumped to CUSA. Its kind of outlines what happens when the footprint is stretched. The CAA is tighter than the Pac12, but an Pac4/AAC footprint will be stretching a similar 1500 to 2000 extra miles over its current footprint.


https://www.pilotonline.com/2016/01/16/m...andidates/

Doing so could save some real cash. ODU’s travel budget nearly doubled when it left the Colonial Athletic Association for C-USA – from $2.2 million in 2012-2013 to $4.1 million this school year. Travel now represents about 10 percent of ODU’s overall athletic spending.

The football team spent $194,690 on lodging, meals and travel for a trip to San Antonio this past season. A year earlier, the Monarchs spent nearly $500,000 combined on two road trips – to Rice and UTEP.

Those games came right after the Monarchs spent $33,267 to bus to a game at North Carolina State.

In all, ODU spent about $1.4 million on football travel this past season, nearly three times what the Monarchs spent in the CAA. And it’s not just football that’s spending more. Everyone’s budgets increased. Travel costs for women’s basketball –$192,905 in 2012-2013 – were projected to grow to $464,002 this season.

The problem here is the great distance teams must travel to get to many C-USA cities. UTEP and ODU are 2,000 miles apart.

That's a comparison of the cost of busing versus flying. Let me give you some information. I don't know how much time you've spent out West, but I typically vacation out West for a month at a time. Nothing, and I mean nothing, is terribly close to anything else. Almost all of the travel will involve flying for the PAC schools. Apples to oranges.

If you cared about being honest, you would have quoted this:

Quote:Georgia State is far removed from the league’s four Texas schools, but Atlanta’s hub airport is a direct flight away.

Why would you think that quote is at all significant? I never said it was difficult to get to far away AAC schools. I said it was more expensive. Now who's deflecting? Ive given you facts. Ive given you distances. Ive given you actual numbers from an athletic department that went through a stretching of its conference footprint. Like I said before, we will just have to agree to disagree.

Repeat after me: They are flying anyway. This isn't a discussion about replacing bus rides with air travel. There is a huge difference.

You're starting to look silly. You still haven't provided any kind of analysis with real numbers to validate your claim of triple the expenditures. In the real world, when people make a claim, if asked to back it up, the responsibility is on them to do so. You have yet to back anything up, except with irrelevant articles and anecdotes. Admit it, you have no clue what the cost increase would be, so please stop pretending.

Do I personally believe travel will cost more? Yes, I do. See, I'm willing to be honest. Do I think it will be so much that it won't be offset by the additional money afforded by the AAC? Absolutely not. Do I think triple the cost is absurd. Yes, I do.

(08-12-2023 07:33 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 06:50 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 06:10 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 02:47 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 02:05 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  Its certainly behind on many metrics---but not academics. USNWR has it at #137. It ranks higher than SDSU, Oregon St, Washington St, OSU, CSU, Hawaii, Fresno, Boise, UTSA, New Mexico, Wyoming, Utah State. After SMU, Tulane and Rice---Tulsa is the next highest USNWR rated FBS school available within a reasonable footprint. Tulsa has struggled lately----but it generally fields a decent football team and above average basketball. In football their best recent finish is 10-3 in 2016 and have finished the last 3 seasons at 6-3, 7-6, and 5-7. So good academics, reasonable geography, and reasonably competitive athletics. Honestly---I have a feeling academics is really all that will actually matter during this rebuild. Thats why I think Air Force will end up making the cut as well.

Very small student body, however. As a PAC deal with Apple is still going to have subscription goals to achieve for a higher payout, can Tulsa add enough to move the dial?

Nope. But I dont think Apple is where the conference is headed. More likely a retooled ESPN/CBS/FOX/Amazon deal is where they end up. Apparently Apple doesnt play well with others and this conference is going to need linear exposure to gain traction for the next TV deal.

ESPN will nudge things towards a merger with their existing asset. I don't see CBS, FOX, and Amazon coming together to offer anything that will beat what ESPN can provide through a modest bump to the AAC contract. You also eliminate all exit fees. You people are acting like the exit fees don't matter when they are very significant and very steep.

Lets say everything you say is correct and it flat impossible to rebuild. Rice and SMU and Tulane tell the Pac4---no thanks---there's just no way we can give up those big games against FAU and Charlotte. Exit fees are too high and nobody will televise the new Pac10 other than YouTube.

Is ESPN going to give these Pac4 teams 3 million each extra for the next 6 years (to make up for lost NCAA credit revenue) and 80 million a year for the next two years to make up for the CFP full share they will be giving up by not rebuilding the Pac4? Is ESPN at least going to give the Pac4 an extra 3 million a year for the massively increased travel costs in the AAC? No?

Then the only sane choice for the Pac4 is to just merge with the MW and keep all the Pac12 NCAA credits. They can merge with the MW and keep the Pac12 CFP pay out for the next 2 more years. They can merge with the MW and end up with one third the travel costs of that nationwide AAC. When that happens---ESPN gets no new western content--and maybe still ends up losing Rice and SMU to this new more attractive Mountain West that has always wanted to get back into Texas. Suddenly, at that point, paving the way for a Pac4 rebuild starts looking like a much better option to ESPN.

I can guarantee you that their is not ONE tv exec of any ilk that wouldn't laugh their collective arse off when you mention RICE. There's tv executives every saying "Open up the books fellas, the PAC4 just signed Rice and Tulsa,,,but wait we can get UTSA also!!!". Geez

(08-12-2023 08:26 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 07:09 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 07:05 PM)PicksUp Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 06:57 PM)msu35 Wrote:  Market and academics mean nothing if there is no winning of games. Ultimately, winning brings the rewards and everyone wants the rewards.

Boise won a lot for a long time and yet they were passed over by the PAC and Big 12 for decades. Even know Im not sure theyd get into a rebuilt PAC.

No doubt, but it doesn't have to be Boise. Irrespective, if the PAC and the leadership was known for making smart decisions, do you think the conference would have imploded overnight? I rest my case.

Academics does not matter in college sports anymore if you want to survive. Gonzaga's name is floating around out there and they are an R3 the same as San Jose State. That right there Stanford would want to keep out as well. SEC and the Big 12 did not went after academics, and you see them as strong as well.

I happen to agree with you DS. Some schools like Memphis have and are being penalized for graduating their communities and building a better society. The snobbery has been over the line. An athlete conference should be just that,,,an athletic conference. I promise you that the tv execs care as much as most of America when they sit down to enjoy a great game day. NONE!!!!

(08-12-2023 06:38 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 02:42 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 12:46 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 12:44 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  The reason its not likely to happen is because there is more money to be had in a sleeker Pac conference. For one, they get to keep all of the NCAA tournament credits currently in the pac. (Somewhere in the vicinity of $50million, maybe quite a bit more.) Also, they continue to get paid the CFP money for a couple of additional years.

That, in of itself, is why the PAC will remain if noone gets into the ACC/B1G, which is not very likely. Its the same reason some of us were laughing when stupid sports writers were thinking the B12 would dissolve and the teams would get absorbed into a non P conference. There was simply way too much money being left for that to happen. And the same exists here.

Then, using a sleeker model of 8 teams then expand a year later to 12 teams, you get a much higher payout year over year. You also get a better geographical east west footprint to work with.

Merging with the AAC and retaining the PAC name is the best possible scenario for a number of reasons.

Not with travel included.

That's why you break things up logically into divisions. Are you saying that traveling to major airports in Oklahoma or Texas is any worse than flying into New Mexico, Colorado, San Diego, or hell even Hawai'i as some people like to throw out? There will be a difference, but not much, and they stand to make more media money this way. ESPN is willing to play ball if the AAC merges with the PAC.

Travel would be worse in a scenario where the PAC fully merges with the AAC versus the MWC. That is why selecting a few schools from each conference makes more sense, both in travel and picking the "best of the rest." Are you really trying to say that a flight from the Bay Area to San Diego is difficult? I have seen CSU and UNLV mentioned as PAC adds, each is easy to get into, though CSU requires an hour bus ride from the airport in Denver to the campus. I have not seen UNM mentioned in that conversation. Hawaii is a bit different as the NCAA allows you to book an extra home game to cover travel costs. Have to say, however, not too many complain about going to Hawaii.

(08-12-2023 08:23 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 08:19 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 08:01 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 07:56 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  One of the two conferences will disappear when a merger occurs. You either move forward as the Pac12---or the AAC (not both--there wont be 2 autobids).

Correct. It will be the AAC merging with the PAC, preserving the PAC for the aforementioned benefits. To do otherwise would never be in consideration by any party.

(08-12-2023 07:56 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  If you choose the Pac12---you do get to keep the Pac12 NCAA credits and the CFP P5 sized payout. However, the AAC NCAA credits revert to the original teams that earned them---and many of those credits would be gone (credits earned by UConn, Houston, and Cinci for instance).

A very easy decision, I assure you.

(08-12-2023 07:56 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  Furthermore, these credits and payouts are now spread over 20 teams---not just 10---so the effect is a 50% cut in the amount these revenue streams produce for the Pac4 teams.

Avoiding the barrier of eight-figure exit fees for every team you bring in, bypassing the negotiations required with so many individual programs, resolving things quickly, and getting a bump from ESPN makes this all very easy to justify.

(08-12-2023 07:56 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  So yes---Im thinking things through.

I was hoping you were going to tell me something new. Furthermore, you avoided the most interesting claim. How would it triple travel expenditures?

Have you looked at map? SMU is over 2000 miles from Oregon St---and thats one of the closest AAC schools. From OSU to New Orleans is over 2500 miles. Im not even using the really far ones. OSU to Temple is about 2900 miles. OSU to USF is almost 3100 miles. For comparison, the distance from Stanford to Boulder Colorado is 1200 miles. The distance from Stanford to WSU is 900 miles. The distance from Stanford to SDSU is 485 miles. So yeah---double to triple the travel costs sounds about right.
L

Sounds like nonsense and excuses. I just tested this. I mocked up two flights from Eugene, OR. One to Colorado Springs, CO and the other to Dallas, TX. Guess what? The flight to Colorado cost $342 and the flight to Dallas cost $339. Imagine that!

FB teams charter. Also, check prices for flights into Denver. From there you are about an hour bus ride to CSU or AFA. The worst travel in the MWC is Laramie. Hard to get a direct flight into Larame and the airport doesn't accommodate jets big enough for a FB charter. You fly into Denver and then bus for two hours with the last part up a winding mountain road.

(08-12-2023 09:57 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 09:07 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 08:23 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 08:19 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(08-12-2023 08:01 PM)msu35 Wrote:  Correct. It will be the AAC merging with the PAC, preserving the PAC for the aforementioned benefits. To do otherwise would never be in consideration by any party.


A very easy decision, I assure you.


Avoiding the barrier of eight-figure exit fees for every team you bring in, bypassing the negotiations required with so many individual programs, resolving things quickly, and getting a bump from ESPN makes this all very easy to justify.


I was hoping you were going to tell me something new. Furthermore, you avoided the most interesting claim. How would it triple travel expenditures?

Have you looked at map? SMU is over 2000 miles from Oregon St---and thats one of the closest AAC schools. From OSU to New Orleans is over 2500 miles. Im not even using the really far ones. OSU to Temple is about 2900 miles. OSU to USF is almost 3100 miles. For comparison, the distance from Stanford to Boulder Colorado is 1200 miles. The distance from Stanford to WSU is 900 miles. The distance from Stanford to SDSU is 485 miles. So yeah---double to triple the travel costs sounds about right.
L

Sounds like nonsense and excuses. I just tested this. I mocked up two flights from Eugene, OR. One to Colorado Springs, CO and the other to Dallas, TX. Guess what? The flight to Colorado cost $342 and the flight to Dallas cost $339. Imagine that!

I dont think that is a pattern that would hold up consistently---especially when the difference in travel distances become wider. One thing I will say that I mentioned in another thread---there is one Pac4/AAC divisional configuration that offers relatively reasonable travel and places the Pac4 in an academic bubble they could probably stomach.

AAC West

Stanford
Cal
OSU
WSU
Tulsa
SMU
Rice
Tulane
Navy

Rest of the AAC, including N Texas and UTSA are in the east. The Pac4 live in a conference bubble with their academic peers and the travel distances are similar to the rebuilt Pac10 conference I proposed (except the shorter trips to SDSU and Air Force are missing). The Pac4 are still taking a substantial hit to their "other" revenue sources like CFP and NCAA credits due to the bloated nature of the merger---but it does give the Pac4 some of what they would get from a Pac4 rebuild. The problem with this configuration is it screws over existing AAC members UTSA and N Texas pretty badly and it also means that there are no crossover football games between divisions because the AAC promised Navy the AAC would never exceed an 8 game schedule. The divisional arrangement would probably need to be utilized for basketball too (as well some non-revenue sports like soccer, volleyball, womens basketball, softball, etc).

Stanford will never ever allow Tulsa into their conference. Their academics is below Boise State. They have been cutting degrees in certain areas to save money. With how many students enrolled? They don't have enough to offer many degrees right now.

Saying that Tulsa's academics is below that of Boise St is just not accurate.

(08-13-2023 12:00 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  Travel would be worse in a scenario where the PAC fully merges with the AAC versus the MWC. That is why selecting a few schools from each conference makes more sense, both in travel and picking the "best of the rest."

In an ideal world, a best of the rest would result in the strongest possible conference. In the real world, exit fees and other complications make it highly unlikely for this to happen in lieu of a media deal, among other factors.

(08-13-2023 12:00 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  Are you really trying to say that a flight from the Bay Area to San Diego is difficult?

No and this was never stated. That's an odd takeaway.

(08-13-2023 12:00 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  Have to say, however, not too many complain about going to Hawaii.

Making the distance and travel time concerns even more suspect.