(03-27-2024 12:00 PM)Pat125 Wrote:  Brian’s statement may have been worded in a less than favorable manner. But it wasn’t awful. Besides, it doesn’t look like UTRGV was impeded from leaving or they were being sued. If this was the move they wanted, it doesn’t matter what mostly empty words stated. Anyway, compare this to Jim’s actions in the ACC.

NJTerp

I am just surprised that he let his emotions and feelings come out like he did. It wasn’t awful. Just surprising. And revealing.

Its not normal to deviate from the standard type of statement unless there is something more going on.

RGV is like Chicago State, an uncompetitive travel nightmare that drags down the conference NET rankings. Other WAC fans/schools are glad they left to be honest. I do not think Cal Football only schools would work out unless they would come as full members. West Texas A&M's Prez is staunchly pro DII/anti DI so they are not a candidate until at least he is replaced. The WAC is fine with 10, but when they do add, it will be football schools for sure.

(03-27-2024 02:18 PM)Spolovilo4EVER Wrote:  RGV is like Chicago State, an uncompetitive travel nightmare that drags down the conference NET rankings. Other WAC fans/schools are glad they left to be honest. I do not think Cal Football only schools would work out unless they would come as full members. West Texas A&M's Prez is staunchly pro DII/anti DI so they are not a candidate until at least he is replaced. The WAC is fine with 10, but when they do add, it will be football schools for sure.

That’s funny coming from a fan of a school that has finishes near last in the conference Commissioners Cup every year. Nobody drags any conference down. I believe Tarleton beat fellow new D1 Utah Tech one year along with Chicago State lol.

https://wacsports.com/sports/2023/4/28/c...20-21.aspx

Facts.

But none of that has anything to do with an unprofessional commissioner that the Texas schools insisted on bringing in because they had connections to him.

Nobody will even want to join a fly by night organization run by an amateur.

(03-27-2024 06:16 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(03-27-2024 03:50 AM)Todor Wrote:  I’m 99% sure I’ve never seen a statement that didn’t at least thank the departing school, or express some appreciation that were members.

It sounds like butthurt. It doesn’t have a kind tone. It’s definitely out of place from the type of statements other conferences typically make when schools move on. It isn’t quite blatant or nasty, but it’s as close as one can get. It doesn’t speak well of him, personally, or the conference.

He doesn’t actually mention RGV until the final sentence. And he doesn’t mention their future plans, or wish them well.

It’s a weird and convoluted statement that he probably felt like he had to make but didn’t really want to, so he did it out of some resentment or anger.

With this guy in charge, the WAC is in trouble. He doesn’t have what it takes to keep it together.

Didn't seem so bad tbh.

The WAC is a way station for the unhoused and commissioner what's-his-name is just trying to keep the lights on.

Not every conference boss is going to be as cool, calm and collected during the bad times as Judy

You talk about her a lot, and it's always mocking or awkward. Have you met her in person, or do you have a secondary school that you like that she's screwed over?

Looking at her in past years, yeah, not very impressive, but she's rallied out of the basement of Conference Commissioners with some solid recent moves.

(03-27-2024 11:32 AM)Utgrizfan Wrote:  

(03-27-2024 10:32 AM)EatEmUp11 Wrote:  

(03-27-2024 09:51 AM)Utgrizfan Wrote:  Personally the WAC needs to do the following (with a bit of help from the Big Sky):

-WAC adds Central Oklahoma and West Texas A&M, both are in a position to fit into FCS and would fit the current WAC footprint

-Encourage/push for non Football members to add it to bring the numbers up, UTA, UVU etc.

-The Big Sky is a bit bloated I feel so Cal Poly and UC-Davis being Football only could join the WAC, honestly would be healthy for both Conferences in terms of OOC games in the long run, could garuntee a full D1 slate for all teams in both Conferences:

WAC.....................................Big Sky

UC-Davis..............................Montana
Cal Poly................................Montana State
SUU.......................................Idaho
UT-Tech................................Idaho State
WTA&M................................Weber State
Central Oklahoma...............Sac State
ACU......................................NAU
Tarleton State......................EWU
SFA.......................................UNC
UT-Arlington.........................Portland State

Why in the world would UC Davis leave the Big Sky which, as you well know I’m sure, is a top two football league and about the only FCS conference that isn’t a skeleton of itself for a far-flung group of D2 callups and former Southland schools that may or may not really want to be there? Not like the Aggies are exactly dead weight either like one could argue Southern Utah was.

SUU messed up bad leaving the Big Sky. Should’ve declined their WAC invitation like Weber did…

It's only an example , but I listed them as they are a Football only member along with Cal Poly and I personally don't think large Conferences work as well in FCS as they do in FBS. Another option would be geography based where NAU and Northern Colorado would move to the WAC, but I feel that's less likely as they're full members. Having another FCS Conference with a decent Western prescence would be good and healthy for all involved in the long run.

Why would the Big Sky be friendly or try to help out a conference that got one member to leave (although most of the conference was happy to help them pack), and tried to take multiple other members?

(03-27-2024 03:50 AM)Todor Wrote:  I’m 99% sure I’ve never seen a statement that didn’t at least thank the departing school, or express some appreciation that were members.

It sounds like butthurt. It doesn’t have a kind tone. It’s definitely out of place from the type of statements other conferences typically make when schools move on. It isn’t quite blatant or nasty, but it’s as close as one can get. It doesn’t speak well of him, personally, or the conference.

He doesn’t actually mention RGV until the final sentence. And he doesn’t mention their future plans, or wish them well.

It’s a weird and convoluted statement that he probably felt like he had to make but didn’t really want to, so he did it out of some resentment or anger.

With this guy in charge, the WAC is in trouble. He doesn’t have what it takes to keep it together. It still has a good future without him, but I can’t imagine him being here another year or two.

https://wacsports.com/news/2024/3/21/gen...alley.aspx

For comparison, look at the positive verbiage used in the AAC announcement about UCF and the others. It s a “normal” and professional statement. But even being voted out and it being more contentious, and a much bigger deal than one school essentially moving down, the statement followed a usual protocol. And language is important.

https://theamerican.org/news/2022/6/10/g...rture.aspx

Or the WCC statement about BYU. Notice the type of statement t being made, how it’s framed, and the vibe compared to the WAC guy?

https://wccsports.com/news/2021/9/10/gen...rence.aspx

You probably have forgotten what happened in 2022 when Lamar jumped ship in July after the football schedules had been finalized, and Incarnate Word also reversed course and did not join. Sam Houston was unable to schedule a 12th game, and other schools ended up playing Western New Mexico, Lincoln, Warner, SW Baptist, and Chadron State.

Lamar had announced in April 2022 that they would be returning to the Southland in 2023-2024 (2023 football season). Then in July they announced they were leaving early, less than two months before the football season began.

Perhaps the WAC commissioner should be grateful that UTRGV is not switching conferences in the middle of a baseball double header.

The WAC lawsuit against UIW is ongoing.

If not for the WAC football project, UTRGV would have been unlikely to start football. And if UTRGV was not starting football, the Southland would not have been interested. Remember that Pan American was in the conference wilderness for decades (TRAA, American South, Sun Belt, Great West, and WAC), even though the logical conference would have been the Southland, particularly after HCU, UIW, and A&M-CC had joined.

Would the Big Sky ever take back Southern Utah if the latter wanted to return?

(03-28-2024 08:29 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  Would the Big Sky ever take back Southern Utah if the latter wanted to return?

Very slim chance of that happening, unless there was movement elsewhere - ie pack to only invited half mountain west and then the mountain West backfilled with some big sky teams

(03-27-2024 04:07 PM)Todor Wrote:  an unprofessional commissioner

I assume this is based on more than this press release.


Because it doesn't seem unprofessional at all.

(03-28-2024 08:34 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(03-28-2024 08:29 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  Would the Big Sky ever take back Southern Utah if the latter wanted to return?

Very slim chance of that happening, unless there was movement elsewhere - ie pack to only invited half mountain west and then the mountain West backfilled with some big sky teams

And that’s the tough part to predict. Some member’s possibly moving to fbs just kind of lingers over the conference.

Letting the Texas schools in was a mistake that continues to wreak havoc on the future of the WAC.

But like I said years ago, one by one, they will leave because their only goal in joining was to try to stick it to the SLC and “prove” they had options.

I did, however, expect RGV to remain as the sole Texas WAC school. I didn’t see them adding football until the neither Texans pressured them. Unfortunately they were too far in to stop the process by the time the WAC football idea flopped. Put them in a tough spot.

As it turned out, the Texas 5 push to add football actually drove out a long time member instead of helping grow.

And that’s what happens when people buy into the pie in the sky dreams of those motivated to hurt their old conference due to bad feelings.

(03-27-2024 07:14 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  You’ve got to remember that there is a lot of bad blood between the Southland and WAC:

The WAC stole SLC teams, selling them on the vision that they had a path the FBS

NMSU and SHSU got invited to a bona fide FBS league

The SLC turned around and stole back 2 teams, Lamar who had spent a season in the WAC and UIW who was scheduled to join in just mere months—this wrecked the planned football schedule.

The loss of 2 schools to promotion and 2 to defection was devastating to the WAC, particularly Southern Utah ex-SLC schools ACU and SFA.

UTRGV would have given the WAC their 6th football school and an autobid to the FCS playoff.

Not sure how bonafide the conference is.
If WAC is so great pick up more schools for football. Notre Dame is available.

(03-29-2024 04:20 PM)Todor Wrote:  

(03-28-2024 08:34 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(03-28-2024 08:29 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  Would the Big Sky ever take back Southern Utah if the latter wanted to return?

Very slim chance of that happening, unless there was movement elsewhere - ie pack to only invited half mountain west and then the mountain West backfilled with some big sky teams

And that’s the tough part to predict. Some member’s possibly moving to fbs just kind of lingers over the conference.

Letting the Texas schools in was a mistake that continues to wreak havoc on the future of the WAC.

But like I said years ago, one by one, they will leave because their only goal in joining was to try to stick it to the SLC and “prove” they had options.

I did, however, expect RGV to remain as the sole Texas WAC school. I didn’t see them adding football until the neither Texans pressured them. Unfortunately they were too far in to stop the process by the time the WAC football idea flopped. Put them in a tough spot.

As it turned out, the Texas 5 push to add football actually drove out a long time member instead of helping grow.

And that’s what happens when people buy into the pie in the sky dreams of those motivated to hurt their old conference due to bad feelings.

Who were the Texas 5? Lamar and Incarnate Word left the WAC, but came back to the Southland. Sam Houston moved up to the FBS, and now UTRGV is leaving for the Southland. That leaves just Abilene Christian, Stephen F. Austin and Tarleton State alongside Southern Utah and Utah Tech.

Tarleton joined first, then the Texas 4 (Sam Houston, SFA, ACU, Lamar).

Once those 5 were in, the reality that football might actually happen on one level or another took shape. And that was the planning period for RGV to assess things and take action.

Dixie was floating around regardless of what happened in Texas. SUU was a bonus but not part of the core football drive originally.

I think we’re reading into the statement because we may be able to understand that the WAC could be a bit annoyed by this move. I think that if they are a little less than enthused, it’s just because of the greater landscape and how the conference wasn’t able to distance itself enough from others to retain the kind of schools it wanted. But the statement itself is pretty neutral.

(03-30-2024 01:01 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  I think we’re reading into the statement because we may be able to understand that the WAC could be a bit annoyed by this move. I think that if they are a little less than enthused, it’s just because of the greater landscape and how the conference wasn’t able to distance itself enough from others to retain the kind of schools it wanted. But the statement itself is pretty neutral.

4/8/2022 Lamar announces return to Southland after 2022-23.

https://wacsports.com/news/2022/4/8/4_8_2022_2146.aspx

Press Release Wrote:The Western Athletic Conference has received notice from Lamar University regarding its intention to depart the league effective June 30, 2023.

The league will have no further comment.

6/24/2022 UIW reneges.

https://wacsports.com/news/2022/6/24/6_2..._2155.aspx

7/1/2022 Southern Utah and UT-Arlington officially become members.

https://wacsports.com/news/2022/7/1/7_1_2022_2156.aspx

7/11/2023 Lamar skips town.

https://wacsports.com/news/2022/7/11/7_11_2022_93.aspx

Press Release Wrote:“While the timing of this decision is not ideal as we reformulate fall schedules, we are excited about the quality programs that remain. Our continuing institutions have shown a history and more importantly a desire to compete at a national level,” added Thornton.

This could be considered to be snarky - or an accurate assessment of Lamar's decision.

3/21/2024 UTRGV announces move.

Press Release Wrote:"The Western Athletic Conference (WAC) acknowledges the intention of the University of Texas Rio Grande Valley to depart the conference effective July 1, 2024.

"We acknowledge UT Rio Grande Valley’s contributions to the WAC in helping grow the conference over the past decade.”

Perhaps a bit awkward with the "acknowledges the intention" compared with "has received notice" with respect to the original Lamar press release. But UTRGV was thanked for their contributions to the WAC.

(03-30-2024 01:54 PM)jimrtex Wrote:  

(03-30-2024 01:01 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  I think we’re reading into the statement because we may be able to understand that the WAC could be a bit annoyed by this move. I think that if they are a little less than enthused, it’s just because of the greater landscape and how the conference wasn’t able to distance itself enough from others to retain the kind of schools it wanted. But the statement itself is pretty neutral.

4/8/2022 Lamar announces return to Southland after 2022-23.

https://wacsports.com/news/2022/4/8/4_8_2022_2146.aspx

Press Release Wrote:The Western Athletic Conference has received notice from Lamar University regarding its intention to depart the league effective June 30, 2023.

The league will have no further comment.

6/24/2022 UIW reneges.

https://wacsports.com/news/2022/6/24/6_2..._2155.aspx

7/1/2022 Southern Utah and UT-Arlington officially become members.

https://wacsports.com/news/2022/7/1/7_1_2022_2156.aspx

7/11/2023 Lamar skips town.

https://wacsports.com/news/2022/7/11/7_11_2022_93.aspx

Press Release Wrote:“While the timing of this decision is not ideal as we reformulate fall schedules, we are excited about the quality programs that remain. Our continuing institutions have shown a history and more importantly a desire to compete at a national level,” added Thornton.

This could be considered to be snarky - or an accurate assessment of Lamar's decision.

3/21/2024 UTRGV announces move.

Press Release Wrote:"The Western Athletic Conference (WAC) acknowledges the intention of the University of Texas Rio Grande Valley to depart the conference effective July 1, 2024.

"We acknowledge UT Rio Grande Valley’s contributions to the WAC in helping grow the conference over the past decade.”

Perhaps a bit awkward with the "acknowledges the intention" compared with "has received notice" with respect to the original Lamar press release. But UTRGV was thanked for their contributions to the WAC.

The statement “acknowledged” their contributions, but did not thank them. Not exactly the same.

(03-27-2024 12:44 PM)Todor Wrote:  

(03-27-2024 09:46 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I really don’t think this statement is too out of the ordinary. It’s not overwhelming gracious in heaping praises on UTRGV but it has all the elements I’d typically expect from a reactionary statement. These are almost always far more focused on the excellence and commitment of the conference rather than thanks and well wishes for the outgoing member.

I do agree that there is a degree of implication that UTRGV is choosing to take a cheaper, easier path.

I agree with you there.

To me, it does reveal a certain level of anger. Possibly merely disappointment or shock. But for it to be at the level of letting that show through in a routine statement is the telling part.

The funniest part of all of this-UTRGV showed little serious interest in football until the Texas 4 came along. And I’m sure there was a lot of pressure to do it, convincing them that this is the future of the WAC and that they should get on board.

So they started the ball rolling, made a public announcement, started investing. And in the meantime, the WAC became the failure and disappointment , because they couldn’t deliver on the conference football home for RGV they “sold.” And that was the point when RGV left. They stretched THEIR budget to try to accommodate the conference and its members needs, even though all of the football joiners knew they were joining a non football conference.

The WAC fumbled this one. RGV would likely not be leaving if they hadn’t added football to keep up with schools that were never committed to the WAC in the first place. Also a fumble on RGV’s part to not have predicted the outcome of of these misfits joining, like I did from day 1.

My gosh, you can't show your anti-WAC bias enough.

UTRGV had ambitions of football for a while. They had ambitions of joining the SLC since the 1990's. They hired an AD who had desires of starting a football program and he's been working on it long before the "Texas Four" joined. The SLC would never accept UTPA as they were, but would have if they had football. UIW and HCU are prime examples. If you told UTPA/UTRGV any time since the Sun Belt exodus and now that they could get into the SLC, they would have taken it.

The SLC also has a higher baseball profile traditionally. UTRGV is on the cusp of a top 50 in attendance and can put the SLC back into consistent two-bid territory. Lamar just had a great weekend and looks to be back where they are historically. SELA is usually nationally competitive. Adding a third competitive schools makes sense for both entities there.


The WAC did not have any impact on their decision to leave, other than spread out geography.

(03-31-2024 08:53 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  

(03-27-2024 12:44 PM)Todor Wrote:  

(03-27-2024 09:46 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I really don’t think this statement is too out of the ordinary. It’s not overwhelming gracious in heaping praises on UTRGV but it has all the elements I’d typically expect from a reactionary statement. These are almost always far more focused on the excellence and commitment of the conference rather than thanks and well wishes for the outgoing member.

I do agree that there is a degree of implication that UTRGV is choosing to take a cheaper, easier path.

I agree with you there.

To me, it does reveal a certain level of anger. Possibly merely disappointment or shock. But for it to be at the level of letting that show through in a routine statement is the telling part.

The funniest part of all of this-UTRGV showed little serious interest in football until the Texas 4 came along. And I’m sure there was a lot of pressure to do it, convincing them that this is the future of the WAC and that they should get on board.

So they started the ball rolling, made a public announcement, started investing. And in the meantime, the WAC became the failure and disappointment , because they couldn’t deliver on the conference football home for RGV they “sold.” And that was the point when RGV left. They stretched THEIR budget to try to accommodate the conference and its members needs, even though all of the football joiners knew they were joining a non football conference.

The WAC fumbled this one. RGV would likely not be leaving if they hadn’t added football to keep up with schools that were never committed to the WAC in the first place. Also a fumble on RGV’s part to not have predicted the outcome of of these misfits joining, like I did from day 1.

My gosh, you can't show your anti-WAC bias enough.

UTRGV had ambitions of football for a while. They had ambitions of joining the SLC since the 1990's. They hired an AD who had desires of starting a football program and he's been working on it long before the "Texas Four" joined. The SLC would never accept UTPA as they were, but would have if they had football. UIW and HCU are prime examples. If you told UTPA/UTRGV any time since the Sun Belt exodus and now that they could get into the SLC, they would have taken it.

The SLC also has a higher baseball profile traditionally. UTRGV is on the cusp of a top 50 in attendance and can put the SLC back into consistent two-bid territory. Lamar just had a great weekend and looks to be back where they are historically. SELA is usually nationally competitive. Adding a third competitive schools makes sense for both entities there.


The WAC did not have any impact on their decision to leave, other than spread out geography.

They have wanted in the Southland for 30+ years, and only pulled the trigger once they were in a much improved conference with nearby schools. That makes perfect sense.

I think we can all see from the “send off” they received that it wasn’t on normal good terms. The Texans have brought in some absolute clown to run things. And he’s running them into the ground. Members just keep fleeing the poor management, fly by the seat of his pants, abrasive style, lack of a coherent plan for anything at all. Such a rapid decline it’s been.

But I’ll be following the WAC as long as it’s around. As I have for many decades.