That's the suggestion from... oh, somebody.

First wave: Florida State and Clemson to P2

Next wave: Duke, UNC, NC State to P2 (SEC?)

https://flywareagle.com/posts/unc-sec-in...-dissolves

(04-15-2024 10:30 AM)Gitanole Wrote:  That's the suggestion from... oh, somebody.

First wave: Florida State and Clemson to P2

Next wave: Duke, UNC, NC State to P2 (SEC)

https://flywareagle.com/posts/unc-sec-in...-dissolves

Roll Tide Wire is pitching Duke among 5 to the SEC and ignoring Clemson & NC State.

Those third tier sports media posters in Alabama sound as if they are fascinated with Duke, but apparently want no part of Clemson.

https://rolltidewire.usatoday.com/lists/...alignment/

(04-15-2024 10:55 AM)OdinFrigg Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 10:30 AM)Gitanole Wrote:  That's the suggestion from... oh, somebody.

First wave: Florida State and Clemson to P2

Next wave: Duke, UNC, NC State to P2 (SEC)

https://flywareagle.com/posts/unc-sec-in...-dissolves

Roll Tide Wire is pitching Duke among 5 to the SEC and ignoring Clemson & NC State.

Those third tier sports media posters in Alabama sound as if they are fascinated with Duke, but apparently want no part of Clemson.

https://rolltidewire.usatoday.com/lists/...alignment/

Old SEC scheduling habits die hard.

Round 1
FSU + Clemson

Round 2
UNC + NC State

Round 3
UVA + Va Tech

Round 4
Duke + GA Tech

(04-15-2024 11:08 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

Round 1
FSU + Clemson

Round 2
UNC + NC State

Round 3
UVA + Va Tech

Round 4
Duke + GA Tech

That would work a treat. But I think Birmingham would take a quick peek at Wallace Wade Outdoor, compare notes with what they see in Nashville, and opt instead for Kansas in Duke's spot. It would make Missouri less awkward, reinstate the Border War, and the 4 divisions of 6 teams would fall into place quite naturally:

Texas, TAMU, Oklahoma, Arkansas, Kansas, Missouri
LSU, Ole Miss, Miss State, Alabama, Auburn, Vanderbilt
Florida State, Florida, Clemson, South Carolina, Georgia, Georgia Tech
Tennessee, Kentucky, North Carolina, NC State, Virginia, Virginia Tech

Football: Everybody in your division, 1 in each of the other divisions.
Basketball: Home and Home in your division, home and home in 1 each of the other divisions
Baseball: Home and home series in your division. OR Series against everyone in your division, then 2 series against each of the other divisions.

(04-15-2024 11:37 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  ... I think Birmingham would take a quick peek at Wallace Wade Outdoor, compare notes with what they see in Nashville, and opt instead for Kansas in Duke's spot

Is it possible, if given the option, KU would prefer the B1G over the SEC?

The suggestion caught my eye because Duke becoming a sort of enabler for a conference to admit both NC public schools... it's an interesting idea. Is Duke's basketball value enough to budge things in that way?

First and foremost our idiots at Auburn are just like the idiots at Alabama which are just like everyone else's idiots. None of them have any information they just get to sell different takes.

Second, going to 24 for either the SEC or Big 10 truly is not profitable unless FOX and ESPN just want to deal with 2 conferences and in that world 26 or 28 is more likely than 24.

Third, I would have to believe that if N.D. wants to continue its all but football relationship with the ACC that ESPN will not permit such a massive disruption of the conference to transpire.

Fourth, I suspect that Clemson and FSU are likely simply because they are suing to get out and ESPN does not want to lose their rights, and that if we move to 20 it would be immediate and would include with them North Carolina and either Duke as indicated in 2011 or N.C. State if circumstances have indeed changed, or a Virginia school. With a Virginia school 4 objectives are met for the SEC. With Duke 4 objectives are met for ESPN as the mouse loves its Winter time punch.

Fifth, default to the Magnificient 7 and Duke/orKansas.

(04-15-2024 11:53 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 11:37 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  ... I think Birmingham would take a quick peek at Wallace Wade Outdoor, compare notes with what they see in Nashville, and opt instead for Kansas in Duke's spot

Is it possible, if given the option, KU would prefer the B1G over the SEC?

What about Duke and Kansas as a pair, the NC publics as a pair?

To either P2 league?

(04-15-2024 12:02 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Second, going to 24 for either the SEC or Big 10 truly is not profitable unless FOX and ESPN just want to deal with 2 conferences and in that world 26 or 28 is more likely than 24.

If introduced pro rata it helps restore balance and increase the entire sports portfolio. If introduced pro rata and at a partial share at first then everybody makes more at least for a bit. Blow up March Madness and any high end basketball assets you acquire suddenly mature to twice their value before you got them.

Going with 28:
Texas, TAMU, Oklahoma, Arkansas, Kansas, Missouri, (OKST/TTU/TCU/Baylor/Nebraska/KSTATE)
LSU, Ole Miss, Miss State, Alabama, Auburn, Florida State, Vanderbilt
Miami, Florida, Clemson, South Carolina, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Tennessee
Louisville, Kentucky, Duke, North Carolina, NC State, Virginia, Virginia Tech

Football: Everybody in your division, 1 in each of the other divisions.
Basketball: Home and Home in your division, home and home in 1 each of the other divisions
Baseball: Home and home series in your division. OR Series against everyone in your division, then 2 series against each of the other divisions.

(04-15-2024 11:53 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 11:37 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  ... I think Birmingham would take a quick peek at Wallace Wade Outdoor, compare notes with what they see in Nashville, and opt instead for Kansas in Duke's spot

Is it possible, if given the option, KU would prefer the B1G over the SEC?

Kansas has a "Who am I most valuable to?" problem. As the farmer's say you don't buy the cow if you are getting the milk for free. The Big 10 draws a lot of eyeballs out of Kansas so the small population state has not been a high priority for them, especially once Missouri was taken by the SEC. Kansas gives the SEC a better reach into markets than they give the Big 10.

Also, I don't think it's a question of what the SEC would want, but rather what ESPN's desires might be should the SEC be getting the sweep it wanted of markets by gaining control of Florida in a dominant way, and locking down 20 million more in Virginia and North Carolina. Adding FSU and Miami would along with 4 Virginia and North Carolina schools essentially accomplishes everything the SEC could want. Clemson and Georgia Tech would be the finishing touches. Now give Duke, Vanderbilt, and Notre Dame all but football memberships, leaving a 4th such slot to be determined. Such a move frees the slot for Kansas as the 24th member.

New SEC: Football

Arkansas, Kansas, Missouri, Oklahoma, Texas, Texas A&M (for Hoops: Houston or Baylor)

Alabama, Auburn, Florida State, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Mississippi State (for hoops Vanderbilt)

Clemson, Florida, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Miami, South Carolina (for hoops Duke)

Kentucky, North Carolina, N.C. State, Tennessee, Virginia, Virginia Tech (for hoops Notre Dame)

(04-15-2024 12:05 PM)Gitanole Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 11:53 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 11:37 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  ... I think Birmingham would take a quick peek at Wallace Wade Outdoor, compare notes with what they see in Nashville, and opt instead for Kansas in Duke's spot

Is it possible, if given the option, KU would prefer the B1G over the SEC?

What about Duke and Kansas as a pair, the NC publics as a pair?

To either P2 league?

I've liked the idea of adding Duke and Kansas as a pair, to the Big10.

I also think the NC schools could work for the SEC. Though I think VT is the better move for markets, etc.

(04-15-2024 10:30 AM)Gitanole Wrote:  That's the suggestion from... oh, somebody.

First wave: Florida State and Clemson to P2

Next wave: Duke, UNC, NC State to P2 (SEC?)

https://flywareagle.com/posts/unc-sec-in...-dissolves

Obviously biased but I think KU gets in over Duke because of the cohort of teams in the western half of the SEC. Synergy with MU, OU, UT, A&M and Arky.

(04-15-2024 11:53 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  Is it possible, if given the option, KU would prefer the B1G over the SEC?

Both are great conferences, and Kansas borders both. And the Pac-12 too, until August 2nd.

(04-15-2024 12:48 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 11:53 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 11:37 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  ... I think Birmingham would take a quick peek at Wallace Wade Outdoor, compare notes with what they see in Nashville, and opt instead for Kansas in Duke's spot

Is it possible, if given the option, KU would prefer the B1G over the SEC?

Kansas has a "Who am I most valuable to?" problem. As the farmer's say you don't buy the cow if you are getting the milk for free. The Big 10 draws a lot of eyeballs out of Kansas so the small population state has not been a high priority for them, especially once Missouri was taken by the SEC. Kansas gives the SEC a better reach into markets than they give the Big 10.

Also, I don't think it's a question of what the SEC would want, but rather what ESPN's desires might be should the SEC be getting the sweep it wanted of markets by gaining control of Florida in a dominant way, and locking down 20 million more in Virginia and North Carolina. Adding FSU and Miami would along with 4 Virginia and North Carolina schools essentially accomplishes everything the SEC could want. Clemson and Georgia Tech would be the finishing touches. Now give Duke, Vanderbilt, and Notre Dame all but football memberships, leaving a 4th such slot to be determined. Such a move frees the slot for Kansas as the 24th member.

New SEC: Football

Arkansas, Kansas, Missouri, Oklahoma, Texas, Texas A&M (for Hoops: Houston or Baylor)

Alabama, Auburn, Florida State, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Mississippi State (for hoops Vanderbilt)

Clemson, Florida, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Miami, South Carolina (for hoops Duke)

Kentucky, North Carolina, N.C. State, Tennessee, Virginia, Virginia Tech (for hoops Notre Dame)

They also have a Kansas City problem.

The moment the SEC added Missouri, Kansas became unnecessary.

Whereas, KC has some distance from the Omaha/Lincoln metro areas.

But discussing market isn't the way to necessarily showcase Kansas' strengths.

You like the idea of them in the SEC. understandable. especially if trying to not expand the SEC footprint too far.

But at this point, looking at other options, I think several ACC schools get into the SEC before Kansas.

But I do think they have a shot at the Big10, as long as they continue their improvement plans.

Two comments:

1) It surprises me that most people think the B1G will standby and let all the remaining brands go to the SEC.

2) It’s remarkable to me that people think Duke University has a spot in the P2. I think Duke has to be sweating it out right now.

(04-15-2024 02:29 PM)Skyhawk Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 12:48 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 11:53 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 11:37 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  ... I think Birmingham would take a quick peek at Wallace Wade Outdoor, compare notes with what they see in Nashville, and opt instead for Kansas in Duke's spot

Is it possible, if given the option, KU would prefer the B1G over the SEC?

Kansas has a "Who am I most valuable to?" problem. As the farmer's say you don't buy the cow if you are getting the milk for free. The Big 10 draws a lot of eyeballs out of Kansas so the small population state has not been a high priority for them, especially once Missouri was taken by the SEC. Kansas gives the SEC a better reach into markets than they give the Big 10.

Also, I don't think it's a question of what the SEC would want, but rather what ESPN's desires might be should the SEC be getting the sweep it wanted of markets by gaining control of Florida in a dominant way, and locking down 20 million more in Virginia and North Carolina. Adding FSU and Miami would along with 4 Virginia and North Carolina schools essentially accomplishes everything the SEC could want. Clemson and Georgia Tech would be the finishing touches. Now give Duke, Vanderbilt, and Notre Dame all but football memberships, leaving a 4th such slot to be determined. Such a move frees the slot for Kansas as the 24th member.

New SEC: Football

Arkansas, Kansas, Missouri, Oklahoma, Texas, Texas A&M (for Hoops: Houston or Baylor)

Alabama, Auburn, Florida State, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Mississippi State (for hoops Vanderbilt)

Clemson, Florida, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Miami, South Carolina (for hoops Duke)

Kentucky, North Carolina, N.C. State, Tennessee, Virginia, Virginia Tech (for hoops Notre Dame)

They also have a Kansas City problem.

The moment the SEC added Missouri, Kansas became unnecessary.

Whereas, KC has some distance from the Omaha/Lincoln metro areas.

But discussing market isn't the way to necessarily showcase Kansas' strengths.

You like the idea of them in the SEC. understandable. especially if trying to not expand the SEC footprint too far.

But at this point, looking at other options, I think several ACC schools get into the SEC before Kansas.

But I do think they have a shot at the Big10, as long as they continue their improvement plans.

On paper KC should be an MU city but it is actually KU tilted. I would argue that KU has the plurality of fans in the KC metro area. It's one of those things people who aren't familiar with the area often think but it's a bit different than the reality of the situation.

(04-15-2024 12:05 PM)Gitanole Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 11:53 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 11:37 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  ... I think Birmingham would take a quick peek at Wallace Wade Outdoor, compare notes with what they see in Nashville, and opt instead for Kansas in Duke's spot

Is it possible, if given the option, KU would prefer the B1G over the SEC?

What about Duke and Kansas as a pair, the NC publics as a pair?

To either P2 league?

That's certainly possible, but it's highly speculative. Even if the value of basketball was to double overnight, it would still only be the 1/3 to football's 2/3 of the total. That might be enough to get UConn a quick M2 invite, but by itself it's not going to move the needle enough to get any school a P2 invite. If Duke or Kansas also had NC State's football, then maybe. However, despite their recent success, they both still have next to no football following, whereas football first schools like NC St (and Alabama!) are sometimes great at basketball and can draw big ratings, as we saw this year.

(04-15-2024 03:24 PM)AzonTheKid Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 02:29 PM)Skyhawk Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 12:48 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 11:53 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 11:37 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  ... I think Birmingham would take a quick peek at Wallace Wade Outdoor, compare notes with what they see in Nashville, and opt instead for Kansas in Duke's spot

Is it possible, if given the option, KU would prefer the B1G over the SEC?

Kansas has a "Who am I most valuable to?" problem. As the farmer's say you don't buy the cow if you are getting the milk for free. The Big 10 draws a lot of eyeballs out of Kansas so the small population state has not been a high priority for them, especially once Missouri was taken by the SEC. Kansas gives the SEC a better reach into markets than they give the Big 10.

Also, I don't think it's a question of what the SEC would want, but rather what ESPN's desires might be should the SEC be getting the sweep it wanted of markets by gaining control of Florida in a dominant way, and locking down 20 million more in Virginia and North Carolina. Adding FSU and Miami would along with 4 Virginia and North Carolina schools essentially accomplishes everything the SEC could want. Clemson and Georgia Tech would be the finishing touches. Now give Duke, Vanderbilt, and Notre Dame all but football memberships, leaving a 4th such slot to be determined. Such a move frees the slot for Kansas as the 24th member.

New SEC: Football

Arkansas, Kansas, Missouri, Oklahoma, Texas, Texas A&M (for Hoops: Houston or Baylor)

Alabama, Auburn, Florida State, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Mississippi State (for hoops Vanderbilt)

Clemson, Florida, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Miami, South Carolina (for hoops Duke)

Kentucky, North Carolina, N.C. State, Tennessee, Virginia, Virginia Tech (for hoops Notre Dame)

They also have a Kansas City problem.

The moment the SEC added Missouri, Kansas became unnecessary.

Whereas, KC has some distance from the Omaha/Lincoln metro areas.

But discussing market isn't the way to necessarily showcase Kansas' strengths.

You like the idea of them in the SEC. understandable. especially if trying to not expand the SEC footprint too far.

But at this point, looking at other options, I think several ACC schools get into the SEC before Kansas.

But I do think they have a shot at the Big10, as long as they continue their improvement plans.

On paper KC should be an MU city but it is actually KU tilted. I would argue that KU has the plurality of fans in the KC metro area. It's one of those things people who aren't familiar with the area often think but it's a bit different than the reality of the situation.

I agree. But this isn't about picking Kansas or Missouri. The SEC already has one.

(04-15-2024 02:18 PM)Skyhawk Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 12:05 PM)Gitanole Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 11:53 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(04-15-2024 11:37 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  ... I think Birmingham would take a quick peek at Wallace Wade Outdoor, compare notes with what they see in Nashville, and opt instead for Kansas in Duke's spot

Is it possible, if given the option, KU would prefer the B1G over the SEC?

What about Duke and Kansas as a pair, the NC publics as a pair?

To either P2 league?

I've liked the idea of adding Duke and Kansas as a pair, to the Big10.

I also think the NC schools could work for the SEC. Though I think VT is the better move for markets, etc.

VT spends more on Athletics than NC St does
VT sells more football tickets
VT gets more eyeballs on TV
VT gets the SEC a new market

The only thing that NC St offers over VT is it placates some NC politicians. We can wait those guys out if necessary, however, or perhaps just let UNC stew in the ACC forever if they can't sort out their own House the way that A&M, OU and Texas did when we joined the SEC without carrying anybody else along as dead weight.