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Concerning the Liberty Bowl...
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HoopDreams Offline
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Post: #101
 
brista21 Wrote:
HoopDreams Wrote:
brista21 Wrote:
St. Patrick Eagle Wrote:UAB vs. Rice has as much of a chance as Cinci Vs USF for the BE title. Being a Cinci fan, it figures you wouldn't now how a C-USA team travels to the LB, and thats OK. How would anybody alive know how Rutgers travels? The proof is in the pudding, we have seen how C-USA teams have traveled compared to the BE in the LB.
Hmm I guess everyone forgets the 2004 NIT finals as a great example of what just a minor taste of winning does with out loyal but downtrodden fans. We packed MSG with a sea of red drowning out anyone and everyone else with Rutgers cheers, chants, songs, etc. Give us a Bowl bid and alumni, students, and fans will descend from all over the country on that game. How does such a terrible team put 31K a game into the seats? Its very simple we have quite possibly the most loyal, diehard fanbase in the country. Tell me what happens when we win you'll see us travel. If we ever won the NC, there'd be grown men weeping, not knowing what to do with themselves. And you wouldn't see rioting either because as the Michigan State game demonstrated you'd see a ton of drunk kids wandering from party to party, bar to bar, to restaurants, etc. Drunk kids not harming anyone or rioting I'll take the drunk kids not harming anyone since I would very likely be amongst them.
yeah, it was such a long commute.......
I've acknowledged that before that it was only to Manhattan, but MSG couldn't give Rutgers enough tickets for that game. And it was the NIT for pete's sake. Trust me on this when we start winning we'll travel we've been waiting for a longtime for this.
I don't doubt you have a good fan base and will travel well, I just am not buying the argument that the LB will phase out CUSA for the BE.......

I have watched several Rutgers basketball games on tv and see the support your team gets at home.....it is rabid and enthusiastic......I think Waters is a solid coach........
07-19-2005 12:06 PM
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St. Patrick Eagle Offline
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Post: #102
 
JIM15068 Wrote:Here are the bowl results and attendance for the last couple decades. It appears that SYR and PITT had respectable crowds.

Jim

Bowl History
Results and Attendance by Year

DATE TEAM ATTENDANCE
12/31/2004 Louisville 44 - Boise State 40 58,355
12/31/2003 Utah 17 - Southern Miss 0 55,917
12/31/2002 TCU 17 - Colorado State 3 55,207
12/31/2001 Louisville 28 - BYU 10 58,968
12/29/2000 Colorado St 22 - Louisville 17 58,302
12/31/1999 Southern Miss 23 - Colorado St 17 56,570
12/31/1998 Tulane 41 - BYU 27 52,192
12/31/1997 Southern Miss 41 - Pittsburgh 7 50,209
12/27/1996 Syracuse 30 - Houston 17 49,163
12/30/1995 East Carolina 19 - Stanford 13 47,307
12/31/1994 Illinois 30 - East Carolina 0 46,212
12/28/1993 Louisville 18 - Michigan St 7 21,097
12/31/1992 Ole Miss 13 - Air Force 0 47,602
12/29/1991 Air Force 38 - Miss St. 15 61,497
12/27/1990 Air Force 23 - Ohio St. 11 32,262
12/28/1989 Ole Miss 42 - Air Force 29 60,128
12/28/1988 Indiana 34 - S. Carolina 10 32,210
12/29/1987 Georgia 20 - Arkansas 17 53,240
12/29/1986 Tennessee 21 - Minnesota 14 51,357
12/27/1985 Baylor 21 - LSU 7 40,186
12/27/1984 Auburn 21 - Arkansas 15 50,180
12/29/1983 Notre Dame 19 - Boston Co. 18 48,071
12/29/1982 Alabama 21 - Illinois 15 54,123
12/30/1981 Ohio St 31 - Navy 28 43,216
12/27/1980 Purdue 28 - Missouri 25 53,667
12/22/1979 Penn St. 9 - Tulane 6 50,021
12/23/1978 Missouri 20 - LSU 15 53,064
12/19/1977 Nebraska 21 - N. Carolina 17 49,456
As I had to explain to Pusher T, do you understand how those Demographics go there. I can assure you it wasn't through the numbers Pitt and Syracuse brought. I was at the 97 Liberty bowl and I felt bad for the small gathering huddled together on the other side. That was Pitt's first bowl in a while and the program was finally turning the corner and should have had a better turnout. The Pitt people that were there were awesome people to enjoy the bowl with, and were having a great time. The numbers also destroy anybodys perception that the Memphus people don't support or attend the bowl. They had large numbers at the parade and the game.
07-19-2005 12:51 PM
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Cubanbull Offline
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Post: #103
 
There is no doubt that the people in Memphis support that bowl BUT not all the people in Memphis are University of Memphis fans, many are SEC supporters.The Liberty Bowl will go after whatever deal will bring more out of town fans into Memphis,more TV exposure.The fact wether we like it or not is that Bowl games were not established to cater the home team but to bring tourist and money to the areas involved.
Holiday Bowl in San Diego is not part of MWC where SDST is a member
same with:
Sun Bowl in El Paso and UTEP
Outback Bowl in Tampa and USF
Champs and Capital one Bowls in Orlando and UCF
Houston Bowl and UH
I remember in the 80-90's when the Orange Bowl was pressed to take UM but businesses were not happy due to the fact that they didnt bring money into the community.
I can understand Memphis fans upset if they abandon CUSA but remember is all about money.
07-19-2005 02:23 PM
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MichiganTiger Offline
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Post: #104
 
Here's the absolute latest LB gossip:

<a href='http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2005/Jul-19-Tue-2005/sports/26906506.html' target='_blank'>http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/200...s/26906506.html</a>

JOE HAWK: Two bowl games tugging league's ear

CORONADO, Calif.

A financial and political tug of war for control of the Mountain West Conference's football champion come bowl season is under way, with the richer, more influential favorite poised to raise his fist in victory as the poorer, less connected underdog seems resolved to land face-first in the mud.

Tina Kunzer-Murphy, executive director of the Las Vegas Bowl, hasn't let go of the rope yet. Let's just say one hand is reaching for the towel she will use to wipe herself off once she picks herself up.

"I fully expect them to do a deal with the Liberty Bowl," a disheartened Kunzer-Murphy said Monday of the Mountain West. "If that happens, our people will be surprised and very disappointed."

With good reason, we say.

When the Liberty Bowl's second three-year contract with the Mountain West -- the conference of which UNLV is a member -- expired in 2004, executives with the Memphis, Tenn.-based bowl began shopping their annual New Year's Eve day game around to more prominent conferences, who they say contacted them. On their end, the executives were looking to upgrade the Liberty Bowl's field of competition and, with a $1.5 million payout to offer, its recognition.

Upon hearing this, the Las Vegas Bowl, which in the past had the "second choice" of teams from the Mountain West, told the conference it would do whatever was necessary, within reason, to bring the regular-season champion to its pre-Christmas game. Among the considerations: Increasing the team's payout from $575,000 to between $900,000 and $1 million and, after this year, when the bowl's existing contract is up with the Pacific-10 Conference that sends the league's fifth-place team to Sam Boyd Stadium, to get the Pac-10 to agree to send its fourth-place finisher.

"We brought them a pretty substantial proposal, we felt," Kunzer-Murphy said.

Well, lo and behold, who should be working the room at the first of two Mountain West Conference Football Media Days on Monday at the Coronado Marriott but none other than a representative of the Liberty Bowl.

Not exactly hat in hand, after failing to work out a better deal with another conference, but with an open hand to anyone with league ties willing to shake it.

Harold Graeter is the game's associate executive director, a former Memphis television sportscaster who does a good job of selling the "tradition and 47-year story" of college football's seventh-oldest bowl game.

Graeter also can spin a pretty good tale, saying, "The Mountain West is at the top of our list of conferences under consideration. We've been contacted by every conference but the Pac-10, and we have had varying levels of conversation with the SEC, ACC, Big East, but we're looking for what will be the best matchup for our game. The fact that I'm here sends a message we are serious about continuing our relationship with the Mountain West."

Why the Liberty Bowl is so interested in the Mountain West, Graeter explains, is that the pairing of two conference champions -- the winner of Conference USA representing the other side of the equation -- makes for a more interesting and significant game.

What isn't explained, however, is why the Liberty Bowl has spent the past six months listening to offers from Bowl Championship Series conferences and why, five months before the 2005 Liberty Bowl is to be played, a contract proposal hasn't been given to Mountain West commissioner Craig Thompson to share with his nine schools.

Even Graeter stressed there are only "conversations and discussions" going on between the Liberty Bowl and the Mountain West at this time. "I wouldn't characterize any of it as negotiations," he said.

Thompson, understandably, feels pinched in the middle.

On one end, he must acquiesce to the demands of his bosses -- the leaders of his Mountain West schools, who probably will see the difference between $1.5 million being offered by the Liberty Bowl and the almost $1 million by the Las Vegas Bowl and recommend signing a new deal with the Memphis game (for a difference of only about $50,000 per school per year, we note).

On the other end, Thompson has heard the groundswell of support from conference media and fans who think the league champion should play in the Las Vegas Bowl. He also is appreciative of the offer by Kunzer-Murphy and her bowl committee to step up with a sweetened deal at a time when the conference appeared to need it.

"I'd like to have had this done yesterday, but one thing I learned from my work dealing with the BCS is that you have to have patience," Thompson said. "Things eventually get done. ...

"Now, whether a difference of $500,000 to $600,000 in equity will determine which way we go, I don't know."

Minutes after Thompson arched his eyebrows as if to say, "Well, you know the answer to that one," Kunzer-Murphy was lowering hers as if to say, "Yeesh! This battle is lost."

"We're hoping to get a chance to share our proposal with the presidents and ADs. That's all we can ask for," she said. "If it doesn't work out, then we'll go shopping around.

"Heck," she added, trying to take the edge off her disappointment, "I'll be off to Nordstrom's."

To get something to replace the clothes she muddied in losing her high-stakes game of tug of war, we suppose.

Joe Hawk's column is published Sunday, Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday. He can be reached at 387-2912 or jhawk@reviewjournal.com.
07-19-2005 02:34 PM
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HoopDreams Offline
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Post: #105
 
Cubanbull Wrote:There is no doubt that the people in Memphis support that bowl BUT not all the people in Memphis are University of Memphis fans, many are SEC supporters.The Liberty Bowl will go after whatever deal will bring more out of town fans into Memphis,more TV exposure.The fact wether we like it or not is that Bowl games were not established to cater the home team but to bring tourist and money to the areas involved.
Holiday Bowl in San Diego is not part of MWC where SDST is a member
same with:
Sun Bowl in El Paso and UTEP
Outback Bowl in Tampa and USF
Champs and Capital one Bowls in Orlando and UCF
Houston Bowl and UH
I remember in the 80-90's when the Orange Bowl was pressed to take UM but businesses were not happy due to the fact that they didnt bring money into the community.
I can understand Memphis fans upset if they abandon CUSA but remember is all about money.
No, Memphis fans who are reactionary are upset about a news report here or there claiming this, but most Memphis fans, especially those with an awareness of the political climate in the city of Memphis, are well aware that the LB will never part ways with whatever conference the University is in......Miami is a lot bigger than Memphis and that city can get away with a power play move like that with little to no political backlash......it would be a nightmare of unseen proportions and that is why it will never happen.......Steve Earhart, Harold Graeter, and everyone else involved with the LB game would be crucified by the media and their life would become a living hell in this town.......with all due respect to Reno, Memphis is the biggest little city in the world.....everyone knows someone within the six degrees of separtion rule here......they would not be able to exist on a daily basis without torment of one form or another.......
07-19-2005 02:37 PM
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GunnerFan Offline
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Post: #106
 
Cubanbull Wrote:There is no doubt that the people in Memphis support that bowl BUT not all the people in Memphis are University of Memphis fans, many are SEC supporters.The Liberty Bowl will go after whatever deal will bring more out of town fans into Memphis,more TV exposure.The fact wether we like it or not is that Bowl games were not established to cater the home team but to bring tourist and money to the areas involved.
Holiday Bowl in San Diego is not part of MWC where SDST is a member
same with:
Sun Bowl in El Paso and UTEP
Outback Bowl in Tampa and USF
Champs and Capital one Bowls in Orlando and UCF
Houston Bowl and UH
I remember in the 80-90's when the Orange Bowl was pressed to take UM but businesses were not happy due to the fact that they didnt bring money into the community.
I can understand Memphis fans upset if they abandon CUSA but remember is all about money.
Not exactly true or an apples to apples comparison. For starters, the Outback (Hall of Fame) and the Cap One (Citrus) have the ability to draw top bill of the non-BCS bowls and neither USF nor UCF have been registering on the 1-A radar for very long. Should either become a truly established football program then their appeal will certainly grow. In the meantime there are plenty of other SEC schools that are close enough.

The Holiday used to feature the champion of the WAC before BYU and co broke off. This included SDSU, though they were never quite the football power to earn the invite more than once, I believe.

While the Houston bowl hasn't been around for very long, it's predecessor the Bluebonnet bowl regularly featured SWC programs, including Houston at least 4 times.

The Orange doesn't mind Miami being in the bowl game as much now, obviously. The hotels aren't as happy but it usually means big ratings and a major game.

As for the Sun Bowl, they haven't had an official tie to UTEP's conference since landing the B10/P10 agreement some 15(?) years ago. Given it's success the bowl had supposedly risen above the need to simply align itself with UTEP unless perhaps a conference champion were involved.

Which is where the Liberty sits. It's been able to have it's cake and eat it to, so to speak, by being in a conference with Memphis but also featuring a conference champion, if not two. I think they'd prefer an alignment with Memphis but are not exactly joined at the hip. Clearly if they could feature an SEC 3 vs. B10 3 they'd take it, so it's just a matter of finding the right balance.

Keep in mind also that only the Sun, Cap One and Liberty bowls rely on their local teams as regular season tenents. The others have pro teams that direct their interest and defray the costs.

I don't think the formula is as simple as saying bowls do/don't need access to the local team, it depends on the bowl, the team and the community. The benefit of having a close tie to a local team is that in years they do qualify and take the bid, which won't be too often in most cases, it usually means good ticket sales. The trade off being that the solid crowds keep the bowl game attractive to fans so that in other years people will travel.
07-19-2005 02:58 PM
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HoopDreams Offline
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Post: #107
 
GunnerFan Wrote:The benefit of having a close tie to a local team is that in years they do qualify and take the bid, which won't be too often in most cases, it usually means good ticket sales. The trade off being that the solid crowds keep the bowl game attractive to fans so that in other years people will travel.
I don't agree with that simply because if you look at the LB numbers for a 65K stadium, its average number is over 50K drawn in fans, no matter the opponent.....I think Memphians support the LB as well and help to fill it up.....I think a sizable part of the Memphis ticket buyers are also University of Memphis supporters and the LB would lose a decent amount of support if that tie was ever severed......
07-19-2005 03:18 PM
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Cubanbull Offline
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Post: #108
 
When all said is done we will find out who will play there when the contract is signed.till then all we are doing is posting reports on different sceneraios.
At the end of the day there will be enough bowls for both conferences
07-19-2005 06:39 PM
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brista21 Offline
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Post: #109
 
HoopDreams Wrote:
brista21 Wrote:
HoopDreams Wrote:
brista21 Wrote:
St. Patrick Eagle Wrote:UAB vs. Rice has as much of a chance as Cinci Vs USF for the BE title. Being a Cinci fan, it figures you wouldn't now how a C-USA team travels to the LB, and thats OK. How would anybody alive know how Rutgers travels? The proof is in the pudding, we have seen how C-USA teams have traveled compared to the BE in the LB.
Hmm I guess everyone forgets the 2004 NIT finals as a great example of what just a minor taste of winning does with out loyal but downtrodden fans. We packed MSG with a sea of red drowning out anyone and everyone else with Rutgers cheers, chants, songs, etc. Give us a Bowl bid and alumni, students, and fans will descend from all over the country on that game. How does such a terrible team put 31K a game into the seats? Its very simple we have quite possibly the most loyal, diehard fanbase in the country. Tell me what happens when we win you'll see us travel. If we ever won the NC, there'd be grown men weeping, not knowing what to do with themselves. And you wouldn't see rioting either because as the Michigan State game demonstrated you'd see a ton of drunk kids wandering from party to party, bar to bar, to restaurants, etc. Drunk kids not harming anyone or rioting I'll take the drunk kids not harming anyone since I would very likely be amongst them.
yeah, it was such a long commute.......
I've acknowledged that before that it was only to Manhattan, but MSG couldn't give Rutgers enough tickets for that game. And it was the NIT for pete's sake. Trust me on this when we start winning we'll travel we've been waiting for a longtime for this.
I don't doubt you have a good fan base and will travel well, I just am not buying the argument that the LB will phase out CUSA for the BE.......

I have watched several Rutgers basketball games on tv and see the support your team gets at home.....it is rabid and enthusiastic......I think Waters is a solid coach........
Oh I don't think the LB is dumping CUSA either. I didn't say I supported that argument. As for Waters I don't think he's that great a coach, I think he needs to go so Fred Hill can take over and get this program going. I maybe a big Schiano loyalist and I think this season will prove why, but I have no love for Waters.
07-19-2005 06:55 PM
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MHSCard Offline
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Post: #110
 
Why on Earth are Memphis people basically threatening peoples careers or political life or the bowl itself over something like bowl alignment??? I mean the Liberty Bowl has produced alot of economic activity for the city and is a fun event. Why would people stop doing it?

Memphis State or Memphis (University of) has NEVER, NOT ONCE EVER has been extended an invite to the Liberty Bowl. Why is this a big deal it is not like it is a change in status quo, Memphis has never been there?
07-19-2005 07:02 PM
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