soxfan1011 Wrote:Hate to say I told you so, but I was right again!

Oooh the ACC took the title which confirms that you are top-heavy. You have UNC, Wake, Duke that are all great programs, beyond that the rest of the conference isn't great. When the Big East's two perennial bottom feeders become upper-middle tier teams in the ACC that speaks volumes. Personally because of the disappointing showing in the tournament by the BE I'd say at best the two conferences are dead even. Next year the BE will be stifling to play in for basketball. I also think we're going to turn some heads in football, not to have them saying we're a great conference but the media pundits will drop their whining and complaining about us having the 6th BCS bid. I think in 5 years the BE will even be the better conference in football ahead of both the Pac 10 and the ACC. The ACC raid was made out of necessity for survival, you guys needed a talent infusion in football so you stole our best 3 teams. However, the BE still stands and its future is promising because people like Pitt AD Jeff Long, Rutgers AD Bob Mulcahy, Rutgers President Richard McCormick, and Connecticut AD Jeff Hathaway all ensured that and stayed loyal to the conference. In 5 years the BE will split the 8 Football Schools if attractive enough and I feel that we will be will then bring Penn State home at last. And don't be surprised to see Boston College come back too, that constant long-distance traveling is gonna get old fast after all. And we'll also reinvite Temple because we all want to see the Eastern Independents back together again. Who will be our 12th member though? I personally feel that a newly strong 1-A all-sports Eastern Conference will lure Maryland into the fold solidifying our presence along the Northeast Corridor region and beyond. Perhaps those are pipe dreams or perhaps I'm on to something, because in reality the BE FB schools becoming attractive enough to lure PSU into the fold domino effecting everything else is entirely possible.

soxfan1011 Wrote:Hate to say I told you so, but I was right again!

Yes you are right

you are a jerk and BCU still sux

brista21 Wrote:In 5 years the BE will split the 8 Football Schools if attractive enough and I feel that we will be will then bring Penn State home at last. And don't be surprised to see Boston College come back too, that constant long-distance traveling is gonna get old fast after all. And we'll also reinvite Temple because we all want to see the Eastern Independents back together again. Who will be our 12th member though? I personally feel that a newly strong 1-A all-sports Eastern Conference will lure Maryland into the fold solidifying our presence along the Northeast Corridor region and beyond. Perhaps those are pipe dreams or perhaps I'm on to something, because in reality the BE FB schools becoming attractive enough to lure PSU into the fold domino effecting everything else is entirely possible.

Now Brista, I thought we covered all this on the old board!

You really want PSU back? If so, here are the two things you'll have to do:

1) Convince the PSU faithful of the virtues of playing in a new eastern conference. Mind you, they turned down the possibility of being #12 for the ACC, a scenario that would've offered similar travel benefits and ensured them roughly the same revenue they make now. Right now I don't think the TV folks could ensure that revenue stream via the BE model, so you'd have to make sure the Lion fans really, really, REALLY wanted this.

2) Convince the B10 it'd be fine with a) losing a major member and b) seeing another conference rise in power right next door. PSU might not be their top football rep on the field, but they still represent a strong TV draw for a state of what, 12 mil? Lose them and the conference will lose some air time, a bowl game and possibly some per-school revenue. Even the B10 fans I know who don't want to stifle the appeal of the Michigan-OSU game would rather grow to 12 than have PSU leave.

Pull that off, and the rest of your dream is possible.

Found this on the Duke board:

ACC 12-4* (NCAA CHAMPIONS: U.N.C.)
(Out in Sweet 16: Duke and NC State.)
(Out in 2nd round: Wake and GT)


Big Ten 12-5* (Runner Up: Illinois)
(Out in Final 4: Michigan State)
(Out in Elite 8: Wisconsin)
(Out in 1st round: Minnesota and Iowa)


Big East 7-6*
(Out in Elite 8 West Virginia)
(Out in Sweet 16: Villinova
(Out in 2nd round: Uconn and BC
(Out in 1st round: Pitt and Syracuse)


Pac-10: 5-4*
(Out in Elite 8 Arizona)
(Out in Sweet 16: Washington)
(Out in 1st round: UCLA and Stanford)


Big 12 6-6*
(Out in Sweet 16: Texas Tech and O.K. State)
(Out in 2nd round: Iowa State and Oklahoma)
(Out in 1st round: Kansas and Texas)


SEC 5-5*
(Out in Elite 8: Kentucky)
(Out in 2nd round: Miss State and Florida)
(Out in 1st round: Alabama and LSU)


... and this on a Kansas board....

Since 1990 - by conference

ACC: 17 Final Fours, 6 NC's
Big10: 15 Final Fours, 1 NC
SEC: 9 Final Fours, 3 NC's
BigXII: 7 Final Fours, 0 NC's
Pac 10: 5 Final Fours, 2 NC's
Big East: 4 Final Fours, 3 NC's
Mountain West: 2 Final Fours, 1 NC's
Conference USA: 3 Final Fours, 0 NC's
Atlantic 10: 1 Final Four, 0 NC's

Since 1995, the ACC has the same amount of NCAA championships as the Big East...

edit: 10 years is better for current power of the leagues, not 15.

GTS, what was C-USA's record in the tourney? If I remember correctly, they had a higher winning percentage. Does that make them better? No.

Quote:Now Brista, I thought we covered all this on the old board!

You really want PSU back? If so, here are the two things you'll have to do:

1) Convince the PSU faithful of the virtues of playing in a new eastern conference. Mind you, they turned down the possibility of being #12 for the ACC, a scenario that would've offered similar travel benefits and ensured them roughly the same revenue they make now. Right now I don't think the TV folks could ensure that revenue stream via the BE model, so you'd have to make sure the Lion fans really, really, REALLY wanted this.

2) Convince the B10 it'd be fine with a) losing a major member and b) seeing another conference rise in power right next door. PSU might not be their top football rep on the field, but they still represent a strong TV draw for a state of what, 12 mil? Lose them and the conference will lose some air time, a bowl game and possibly some per-school revenue. Even the B10 fans I know who don't want to stifle the appeal of the Michigan-OSU game would rather grow to 12 than have PSU leave.

Pull that off, and the rest of your dream is possible.

-- Good to see ya over here Gunner Fan

-- One of the few tidbits of inside info that was mady priovy too (which really isn't inside after the BE papers came out) is that the BE did indeed make an offer to PSU after the raid...and it was basically the same deal the league offered Miami to stay with the exception of the league was notpaying for PSUs travel expenses like they would have Miami's....it is my understanding that with a fairly large % of the BEs BCS/TV cash guranteed to the Nits the BE was in the ballpark in terms of money...the official reason for PSUs decline was the academic alliance of the Big 10

-- Now for us to have any chance...the following has to happen

1. Uconn and Louisville are going to have to expand there staduims to 60,000

2. UC has to become more competitve in football

3. BE football schools have to form an academic alliance...now it won't be as stong as the Big 10s for sure but one has to be in place....and according to some posters on this board this is already secretly being worked on

4. Pitt and Penn st have to settle there fued....Joe Pa needs to recognize what's done is done and Johnny Majors and Jakie Sherrill are long gone from the Pitt sideline


-- If all these things happen the BE will have a better chance at PSU...but still probably not a good chance

Jackson

georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:Found this on the Duke board:

    ACC 12-4* (NCAA CHAMPIONS: U.N.C.)
    (Out in Sweet 16: Duke and NC State.)
    (Out in 2nd round: Wake and GT)


    Big Ten 12-5* (Runner Up: Illinois)
    (Out in Final 4: Michigan State)
    (Out in Elite 8: Wisconsin)
    (Out in 1st round: Minnesota and Iowa)


    Big East 7-6*
    (Out in Elite 8 West Virginia)
    (Out in Sweet 16: Villinova
    (Out in 2nd round: Uconn and BC
    (Out in 1st round: Pitt and Syracuse)


    Pac-10: 5-4*
    (Out in Elite 8 Arizona)
    (Out in Sweet 16: Washington)
    (Out in 1st round: UCLA and Stanford)


    Big 12 6-6*
    (Out in Sweet 16: Texas Tech and O.K. State)
    (Out in 2nd round: Iowa State and Oklahoma)
    (Out in 1st round: Kansas and Texas)


    SEC 5-5*
    (Out in Elite 8: Kentucky)
    (Out in 2nd round: Miss State and Florida)
    (Out in 1st round: Alabama and LSU)


... and this on a Kansas board....

    Since 1990 - by conference

    ACC: 17 Final Fours, 6 NC's
    Big10: 15 Final Fours, 1 NC
    SEC: 9 Final Fours, 3 NC's
    BigXII: 7 Final Fours, 0 NC's
    Pac 10: 5 Final Fours, 2 NC's
    Big East: 4 Final Fours, 3 NC's
    Mountain West: 2 Final Fours, 1 NC's
    Conference USA: 3 Final Fours, 0 NC's
    Atlantic 10: 1 Final Four, 0 NC's

Well I found this to be true this season : Head to Head the acc is 5-8 against the BE this past season. :laugh: The BE is the only conference to have a winning record against the acc this season.

All I'm saying is that from the beginning I have said the ACC is better in football and basketball and I have been proven right on both.

As for the football there is no argument there. Don't even try. Anybody remember the BE champs bowl game performance? lol.

Basketball was a little more tight, but I was right again. WHOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!1

First, lets all remember some things:

A) Raise your hand if you think your conference is the best thing since sliced bread (Sun Belt fans excluded.) Wow, looks like everyone has there hand up! How can that be? Oh yeah, this is all subjective.

B) No one fan or even a small group of fans speaks for any school or conference. If that were the case any school could look like a house of loons or a bastion for morality, when we all know they're all relatively compromised on both counts. There's a reason that average or common conditions exist.

So everything should be taken with a grain of salt or taken to the smack board.

A national champion doesn't make a conference the best. Was the WAC the best for football when BYU won their national title? I don't think so. I'm an ACC fan, and even I'll concede that the new BE will probably be stronger in basketball by virtue of having a deeper pool of top end talent. But comparisons like VT and Miami's performances in the ACC this year vs their showings in the BE last years are barely valid; Who knows how they'd have done against WVU, G'town and company? Fact is both schools and their fans said they're so excited about the move they'd rise to the occasion, and clearly they did. (Including a game at the expense of my beloved Jackets.)

Bickering over #1 and #2 at this point is pretty weak, subject to change and opinion, not to mention it misses the obviously more important issue; Making sure the SEC sucks!!!!!1

- - - - - - -

Hey, Jackson. Nice to hang with you again. My point regarding PSU factored one critical angle: That all conference members would be paid equal shares of conference revenues. If the BE were to give that up they could probably lure ND and PSU, but at what price?

GunnerFan Wrote:Bickering over #1 and #2 at this point is pretty weak, subject to change and opinion, not to mention it misses the obviously more important issue; Making sure the SEC sucks!!!!!1

Now I definitely agree with that sentiment, particularly making sure the SEC sucks. They have no business being any good at basketball.

brista21 Wrote:

GunnerFan Wrote:Bickering over #1 and #2 at this point is pretty weak, subject to change and opinion, not to mention it misses the obviously more important issue; Making sure the SEC sucks!!!!!1

Now I definitely agree with that sentiment, particularly making sure the SEC sucks. They have no business being any good at basketball.

Im more interested in making sure the acc sucks.

Quote:Hey, Jackson. Nice to hang with you again. My point regarding PSU factored one critical angle: That all conference members would be paid equal shares of conference revenues. If the BE were to give that up they could probably lure ND and PSU, but at what price?

-- I see...but the BE has never given equal shares to anyone....BCS money is divided based on a schools performance so Pitt got more cash then Rutges this past yr....and if I remember correctly Miami from the begining was given special finacial considerations by the BE that no other football member enjoyed

-- If I were in charge and certain conditions played themselves out in a favorable way for the BE...I would again make a Miami-like offer to the Nits in 2008 or whenever the split will be announced...I would trade short term cash in exchange for long term stability....but like I said above even if that does happen the odds are not good for the BE getting PSU


Jackson

soxfan1011 Wrote:All I'm saying is that from the beginning I have said the ACC is better in football and basketball and I have been proven right on both.

As for the football there is no argument there. Don't even try. Anybody remember the BE champs bowl game performance? lol.

Basketball was a little more tight, but I was right again. WHOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!1

But we're talking about basketball. I remember the BE bowl performance. Since you brought up football, Do you remember What happened to BC in their very last BE game, against Syracuse? I do, and its pretty funny hearing you criticize BE football when you never ever even sniffed a conference championship.
What matters to me most is this:

HEAD to HEAD= BIG EAST 8 wins/ACC 5[B]



How does it feel to be going to a superior fb conference now, and an inferior basketball conference? Enjoy.

soxfan1011 Wrote:All I'm saying is that from the beginning I have said the ACC is better in football and basketball and I have been proven right on both.

As for the football there is no argument there. Don't even try. Anybody remember the BE champs bowl game performance? lol.

Basketball was a little more tight, but I was right again. WHOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!1

Remember FSU was beaten by Louisville the last time we played and Miami escaped by 3 against Louisville. In 2006 Miami has to come to Louisville and the Ville will win! Louisville has slaughered most of the ACC!

Oh humility, where hast thou run off to?

I'm glad the Cardinals have joined the BE, and frankly feel it's a much better fit given the potential within the regional relationships of UofL, Cincy, Pitt and WVU. And I don't think anyone (certainly not I) has denied the performance of the Cardinal teams on the field as of late.

Serious questions for Louisville fans of this board, however. Nearly every Louisville fan I knew before the realignment (through high school and college and including lower level Cardinal AD staff) pined for membership with the ACC. Since the concept of BE expansion never touched the radar screen back then, these Cardinal fans wanted to be a part of ACC basketball: Another southeastern culture, mixing it up with UNC on a regular basis and fostering their rivalry with Kentucky all the more. Why the sudden change in air? Would you have rather stayed in CUSA? Is the vitriol you folks are now directing toward the ACC some latent feeling of rejection or New Big East pride on steroids? Hearing it from the old BE schools I can understand, even I'm miffed at BC. But from Louisville, I still don't get it.

Seriously, just asking.

The Acc is better at thinking that they are better. They are alos probably in getting others to think that they are better. Live in Acc country, and you will see some of their superior attitude, especially UNC- craple hole.

soxfan1011 Wrote:As for the football there is no argument there. Don't even try. Anybody remember the BE champs bowl game performance? lol.

In case you missed it the top two finishers in the ACC were the two Big East Teams that went south. The ACC blows in FB and they knew it, that's why they went after Miami. VT was forced upon them and you were invited for the mistaken notion that you bring the Boston TV market. Welcome to PSU's nightmare. You're a NE team in a southern conference. Your recruiting in the NE is going to dry up and there is no way you'll get alot of southern kids to come to Bahstn. When the two sides split in 2010 I'll be amazed if you don't come crawling back to the BE.

cuseroc Wrote:Well I found this to be true this season : Head to Head the acc is 5-8 against the BE this past season. :laugh: The BE is the only conference to have a winning record against the acc this season.

Head-to-head is skewed unless done in a style of the ACC-Big10 Challenge.

Shannon Panther Wrote:In case you missed it the top two finishers in the ACC were the two Big East Teams that went south. The ACC blows in FB and they knew it, that's why they went after Miami. VT was forced upon them and you were invited for the mistaken notion that you bring the Boston TV market. Welcome to PSU's nightmare. You're a NE team in a southern conference. Your recruiting in the NE is going to dry up and there is no way you'll get alot of southern kids to come to Bahstn. When the two sides split in 2010 I'll be amazed if you don't come crawling back to the BE.

Say what you want, the ACC was better than the BE and Pac-10 before expansion. [I also consider the BE better than the Pac-10... but another story for another day] In fact, the year before they had the highest final Sagarin of all the conferences, and won the ESPN Bowl Trophy.

I realize there is this stigma attached to ACC football before expansion, so I won't even bother to argue beyond that.