(07-02-2022 03:54 PM)GreenFreakUAB Wrote:  ...ok, another wild rumor deal - which is actually one that is 'rumored to be in the works' anyway, but this is... The DUDE from West Virginia, so... bookit...

MH ver3@MH ver3 · 2h
My source just informed me that Arizona, Colorado, Utah, and Arizona State have applied for membership with the B12. Things are getting crazy!

MH ver3@MH ver3 · 1h
The four schools that applied for B12 were already told outright “no thanks” by B1G

...and this might be the case, but who knows if it actually 'takes'... I HAVE read enough from the BIGXII side of things to know they are taking a 'proactive' approach, so... this move WOULD be a no-brainer if you want to get the jump on any PAC raiding of the BIGXII....

I'm not sure that's the actual DUDE but just another WV dude that never gets anything right.

Looking for P4, so fine by me, I don't care if P10 or B12 goes as long as one does.

Of course SEC and B10 are halting the consolidation process. Academics arent financial managers and it shows with their actions here.

...Y'all are right on about the ID of the 'source' - I forgot THIS WV 'DUDE' is the TuxedoYoda one... and to make things even MORE confusing, there's now a 'Gold and Blue DUDE' from WV making YouTubes about realignment (college sports, not automotive issues )...not sure if he is one of the ORIGINAL WV 'DUDES' or a NEW 'DUDE'.... I mean.... c'mon... DUUUUDE....

(07-03-2022 11:07 AM)GreenFreakUAB Wrote:  ...Y'all are right on about the ID of the 'source' - I forgot THIS WV 'DUDE' is the TuxedoYoda one... and to make things even MORE confusing, there's now a 'Gold and Blue DUDE' from WV making YouTubes about realignment (college sports, not automotive issues )...not sure if he is one of the ORIGINAL WV 'DUDES' or a NEW 'DUDE'.... I mean.... c'mon... DUUUUDE....

If I remember correctly there was:
Dude from WV
MHvr3
Tuxedo Yoda
Fluguar

(07-03-2022 10:56 AM)RUScarlets Wrote:  Who stands in line to give the Big 12 their next contract? If Fox does, then they have every incentive to strip the PAC and leave behind WSU and OSU.

Pretty certain it is Fox. Read the Fox Sports CEO tweet about the new Big 12 commissioner and his talk about being an important partner building on the future Big 12 relationship. He said that a few days before the USC and UCLA announcement.....he is one of the very few that knew in advance of the earthquake about to happen. It seems Fox has orchestrated the euthanasia of the PAC. Move the most valuable to B1G and then the mid tier to Big 12 and now have all the programs with any value, but one less conference to pay.

(07-03-2022 11:12 AM)Scoochpooch1 Wrote:  

(07-03-2022 11:07 AM)GreenFreakUAB Wrote:  ...Y'all are right on about the ID of the 'source' - I forgot THIS WV 'DUDE' is the TuxedoYoda one... and to make things even MORE confusing, there's now a 'Gold and Blue DUDE' from WV making YouTubes about realignment (college sports, not automotive issues )...not sure if he is one of the ORIGINAL WV 'DUDES' or a NEW 'DUDE'.... I mean.... c'mon... DUUUUDE....

If I remember correctly there was:
Dude from WV
MHvr3
Tuxedo Yoda
Fluguar

...I've seen some Flugar posts as well... honestly, I'm not even ON Twitter, I just glean from other sites - The UCONN Boneyard is one I frequent ('lurk' is the term, I reckon), and they have a 'running post' with all 'realignment tweets'... I got all caught up with UCONN in the last round of realignment... funny that my Blazers have a home and home FB with them in a few seasons... I'd love to see that 'parlayed' into a home-and-home in basketball, too...

(07-03-2022 11:12 AM)Scoochpooch1 Wrote:  

(07-03-2022 11:07 AM)GreenFreakUAB Wrote:  ...Y'all are right on about the ID of the 'source' - I forgot THIS WV 'DUDE' is the TuxedoYoda one... and to make things even MORE confusing, there's now a 'Gold and Blue DUDE' from WV making YouTubes about realignment (college sports, not automotive issues )...not sure if he is one of the ORIGINAL WV 'DUDES' or a NEW 'DUDE'.... I mean.... c'mon... DUUUUDE....

If I remember correctly there was:
Dude from WV
MHvr3
Tuxedo Yoda
Fluguar

Yes. MHVer3 might be a cousin, but he is not the Dude from WV.
Tuxedo Yoda is from Texas and claimed to know someone in the Texas athletic department (probably a janitor).
Fluguar is a Dude from Minnesota who talks to fictional people.

Regardless of where we think the source of this rumor (I would just call it speculation) is, we shouldn't dismiss the likelihood of it actually happening.

I don't believe the B1G is finished taking PAC teams by 2024. There are four plums left, IMO: Stanford, Cal, Oregon and Washington. If all four were to be invited, I'm sure they would accept. But before they do, they might privately float the idea that they would be agreeable to dissolve the PAC so nobody had to pay exit fees on their way out. They would certainly have to do that in a way that left none of their fingerprints on the plan, which could be construed by lawyers for Wazzou and Oregon State as unlawful collusion.

The Four Corners schools would first have to have a certain home in the Big 12 where they would fit seamlessly in a 3-2-2-2 football schedule. Arizona, Arizona State and Utah could join BYU as each other's primary partners, while Colorado could do the same with Kansas, Kansas State and Oklahoma State.

My reluctance to predict this stems from doubts the B1G would jump to 20 members instead of 18 (to take USC and UCLA off such a tiny island). That doesn't mean these four schools wouldn't end up in the B12. It just means that 8 PAC schools would have to pay a hefty exit fee to the four northwestern schools left behind.

(07-03-2022 11:00 AM)Scoochpooch1 Wrote:  

(07-02-2022 03:54 PM)GreenFreakUAB Wrote:  ...ok, another wild rumor deal - which is actually one that is 'rumored to be in the works' anyway, but this is... The DUDE from West Virginia, so... bookit...

MH ver3@MH ver3 · 2h
My source just informed me that Arizona, Colorado, Utah, and Arizona State have applied for membership with the B12. Things are getting crazy!

MH ver3@MH ver3 · 1h
The four schools that applied for B12 were already told outright “no thanks” by B1G

...and this might be the case, but who knows if it actually 'takes'... I HAVE read enough from the BIGXII side of things to know they are taking a 'proactive' approach, so... this move WOULD be a no-brainer if you want to get the jump on any PAC raiding of the BIGXII....

I'm not sure that's the actual DUDE but just another WV dude that never gets anything right. ...

Yes, that is quite right ... this is not THE Dude from WV, it is merely A Dude, possibly from WV (I don't recall for sure where he claims to come from, but given his track record, I would take even that with a grain of salt).

(07-03-2022 12:43 PM)ken d Wrote:  Regardless of where we think the source of this rumor (I would just call it speculation) is, we shouldn't dismiss the likelihood of it actually happening.

I don't believe the B1G is finished taking PAC teams by 2024. There are four plums left, IMO: Stanford, Cal, Oregon and Washington. If all four were to be invited, I'm sure they would accept. But before they do, they might privately float the idea that they would be agreeable to dissolve the PAC so nobody had to pay exit fees on their way out. They would certainly have to do that in a way that left none of their fingerprints on the plan, which could be construed by lawyers for Wazzou and Oregon State as unlawful collusion.

The Four Corners schools would first have to have a certain home in the Big 12 where they would fit seamlessly in a 3-2-2-2 football schedule. Arizona, Arizona State and Utah could join BYU as each other's primary partners, while Colorado could do the same with Kansas, Kansas State and Oklahoma State.

My reluctance to predict this stems from doubts the B1G would jump to 20 members instead of 18 (to take USC and UCLA off such a tiny island). That doesn't mean these four schools wouldn't end up in the B12. It just means that 8 PAC schools would have to pay a hefty exit fee to the four northwestern schools left behind.

Not if they are waiting til 2024.

But otherwise, I agree, it would appear to be in the interests of all but OR state and WA state, to dissolve and walk away - IF the rest were to get B10/B12 invites.

Remember before USC/UCLA to B1G the XII was talking on and off about going to 14 at some point to get its membership size more in line with the ACC, B1G etc.

That is something the PAC is going to want to look at, getting to 14 to keep up with the ACC by taking XII schools.

The idea of the XII expanding to 14 or beyond is DOA by comparison since they'll be forced to reload just to return to 12 here shortly.

(07-03-2022 12:43 PM)ken d Wrote:  Regardless of where we think the source of this rumor (I would just call it speculation) is, we shouldn't dismiss the likelihood of it actually happening.

I don't believe the B1G is finished taking PAC teams by 2024. There are four plums left, IMO: Stanford, Cal, Oregon and Washington. If all four were to be invited, I'm sure they would accept. But before they do, they might privately float the idea that they would be agreeable to dissolve the PAC so nobody had to pay exit fees on their way out. They would certainly have to do that in a way that left none of their fingerprints on the plan, which could be construed by lawyers for Wazzou and Oregon State as unlawful collusion.

The Four Corners schools would first have to have a certain home in the Big 12 where they would fit seamlessly in a 3-2-2-2 football schedule. Arizona, Arizona State and Utah could join BYU as each other's primary partners, while Colorado could do the same with Kansas, Kansas State and Oklahoma State.

My reluctance to predict this stems from doubts the B1G would jump to 20 members instead of 18 (to take USC and UCLA off such a tiny island). That doesn't mean these four schools wouldn't end up in the B12. It just means that 8 PAC schools would have to pay a hefty exit fee to the four northwestern schools left behind.

What kind of fee do they have to pay? Their contract ends in 2023-24 season.

(07-03-2022 01:12 PM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  Remember before USC/UCLA to B1G the XII was talking on and off about going to 14 at some point to get its membership size more in line with the ACC, B1G etc.

That is something the PAC is going to want to look at, getting to 14 to keep up with the ACC by taking XII schools.

The idea of the XII expanding to 14 or beyond is DOA by comparison since they'll be forced to reload just to return to 12 here shortly.

The only way the PAC gets to 14 is inviting MW schools. The schools that can get out before having to play conference games against Boise and UNLV are leaving and they are securing their landing slots earlier rather than later.

(07-03-2022 01:21 PM)Big Frog II Wrote:  

(07-03-2022 12:43 PM)ken d Wrote:  Regardless of where we think the source of this rumor (I would just call it speculation) is, we shouldn't dismiss the likelihood of it actually happening.

I don't believe the B1G is finished taking PAC teams by 2024. There are four plums left, IMO: Stanford, Cal, Oregon and Washington. If all four were to be invited, I'm sure they would accept. But before they do, they might privately float the idea that they would be agreeable to dissolve the PAC so nobody had to pay exit fees on their way out. They would certainly have to do that in a way that left none of their fingerprints on the plan, which could be construed by lawyers for Wazzou and Oregon State as unlawful collusion.

The Four Corners schools would first have to have a certain home in the Big 12 where they would fit seamlessly in a 3-2-2-2 football schedule. Arizona, Arizona State and Utah could join BYU as each other's primary partners, while Colorado could do the same with Kansas, Kansas State and Oklahoma State.

My reluctance to predict this stems from doubts the B1G would jump to 20 members instead of 18 (to take USC and UCLA off such a tiny island). That doesn't mean these four schools wouldn't end up in the B12. It just means that 8 PAC schools would have to pay a hefty exit fee to the four northwestern schools left behind.

What kind of fee do they have to pay? Their contract ends in 2023-24 season.

That's a very good question. It appears that the PAC bylaws may differ from some other conferences (including the ACC) with respect to the wording of the consequences of withdrawal. If I'm reading it correctly now (I wasn't before), if a school provides notice of withdrawal before August 2024 the conference may withhold all revenue distributions. So, did USC and UCLA formally give such notice from the PAC, or did they just promise the B1G that they will join in 2024? That's a technicality, but it looks like as long as nobody formally gives notice of withdrawal the remaining schools may be screwed. I would have thought their lawyers would have prevented such a loophole.

If that's the case, no current member has to convince anyone to vote for dissolution. Just wait them out. That makes the survival of the PAC very much in doubt, which in turn likely keeps any other P5 school (like B12 members) from joining them. They can't poach - only be poached. RIP, PAC12.

(07-03-2022 12:43 PM)ken d Wrote:  Regardless of where we think the source of this rumor (I would just call it speculation) is, we shouldn't dismiss the likelihood of it actually happening.

I don't believe the B1G is finished taking PAC teams by 2024. There are four plums left, IMO: Stanford, Cal, Oregon and Washington. If all four were to be invited, I'm sure they would accept. But before they do, they might privately float the idea that they would be agreeable to dissolve the PAC so nobody had to pay exit fees on their way out. They would certainly have to do that in a way that left none of their fingerprints on the plan, which could be construed by lawyers for Wazzou and Oregon State as unlawful collusion.

The Four Corners schools would first have to have a certain home in the Big 12 where they would fit seamlessly in a 3-2-2-2 football schedule. Arizona, Arizona State and Utah could join BYU as each other's primary partners, while Colorado could do the same with Kansas, Kansas State and Oklahoma State.

My reluctance to predict this stems from doubts the B1G would jump to 20 members instead of 18 (to take USC and UCLA off such a tiny island). That doesn't mean these four schools wouldn't end up in the B12. It just means that 8 PAC schools would have to pay a hefty exit fee to the four northwestern schools left behind.

It would be an interesting tactic to intentionally slow-play the 6 Pac12 traditional bluebloods move to the BIG in effort to create enough uncertainty and doubt that you get the mountain schools to leave. that gets the conference down to 6. Then Oregon, Cal, UW, Stanford vote to dissolve, only to find out, oh, the BIG will take all 4!

We are not far off from that if it we truly have a case in which the BIG has told UU, CU, AZ, ASU "no chance", has openly taken Oregon and UW applications, and are broadcasting that first ND gets to basically pick their partner (hello longtime rival Stanford). Oh, and somehow UCLA can easily sidestep state politics and leave Cal in a very bad spot?

That combination kind of reeks of yelling "fire, everyone run" to either lower the votes needed for dissolution, or have 10 schools just walk come 2024.

More likely though, is the BIG is okay with stopping at 18 if it includes ND, and getting the lay of the land

New report that the Big 12 will be meeting on Tuesday with Arizona, Arizona State, Utah and Colorado:

https://247sports.com/college/arizona/Ar...189624231/

We already know the Big 12 is looking to expand and is targeting the Pac-12, so this isn’t a meeting for the four schools to pitch themselves to the Big 12. It’s a meeting for the Big 12 to make its pitch to the four schools.

This could be a another very eventful week.

If USC and UCLA don't plan to join the B1G until 2024, and at that date could simply walk away from the PAC with no penalty whatsoever, why did they announce now that they were leaving? Doesn't that mean that for the next two years they get no revenue from the PAC? Would that also be true for the four schools that are talking to the Big 12? The difference for them, though, is that when they get to the Big 12 they won't get much of a pay bump to help pay back that lost two years of revenue.

Something doesn't seem to add up here.

(07-03-2022 04:47 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  New report that the Big 12 will be meeting on Tuesday with Arizona, Arizona State, Utah and Colorado:

https://247sports.com/college/arizona/Ar...189624231/

We already know the Big 12 is looking to expand and is targeting the Pac-12, so this isn’t a meeting for the four schools to pitch themselves to the Big 12. It’s a meeting for the Big 12 to make its pitch to the four schools.

This could be a another very eventful week.

If I am the BIG12 I invite Zona and ASU. I would then ask BYU about Utah, and I might not invite Colorado since they left in the first place.but the Arizona schools for sure, maybe even Stanford and Cal.

(07-03-2022 05:56 PM)GTFletch Wrote:  

(07-03-2022 04:47 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  New report that the Big 12 will be meeting on Tuesday with Arizona, Arizona State, Utah and Colorado:

https://247sports.com/college/arizona/Ar...189624231/

We already know the Big 12 is looking to expand and is targeting the Pac-12, so this isn’t a meeting for the four schools to pitch themselves to the Big 12. It’s a meeting for the Big 12 to make its pitch to the four schools.

This could be a another very eventful week.

If I am the BIG12 I invite Zona and ASU. I would then ask BYU about Utah, and I might not invite Colorado since they left in the first place.but the Arizona schools for sure, maybe even Stanford and Cal.

Colorado has markets and history with the Big 8 and Big 12 schools. They aren’t going to be left behind.

Here is the wording in the PAC12 by-laws regarding withdrawal from the conference.

Chapter 2, Section 3: Withdrawal

No member shall deliver a notice of withdrawal to the Conference in the period beginning on July 24, 2011, and ending on August 1, 2024; provided that if any member does deliver a notice of withdrawal prior to August 1, 2024, in violation of this chapter, the Conference shall be entitled to an injunction and other equitable relief to prevent such breach, and if a court of competent jurisdiction shall deny the Conference such injunctive relief, the Conference shall be entitled to retain all the media and sponsorship rights in the multi-player video distribution (MPVD) and telecommunications / wireless categories of the member purporting to withdraw through August 1, 2024, even if the member is then a member of another conference or an independent school for some or all intercollegiate sports competitions. Additionally, if a member delivers notice of withdrawal in violation of this chapter, the member's representative to the CEO group shall automatically cease to be a member of the CEO Group and shall cease to have the right to vote on any matter before the CEO Group.

Chapter 2, Section 4: Termination, Suspension and Probation

The Conference may place a member on probation or suspension, or terminate its membership, by vote of at least three-fourths of all the members of the CEO Group eligible to vote on the matter, for one or more of the following reasons:

c. Withdrawing or attempting to withdraw from the Conference without complying
with Section 3 above.

*******************************************************************

Here is how I interpret that. Keep in mind I am not a lawyer, and there may be legal reasons why my interpretation is incorrect.

If a member (USC and UCLA) delivers a notice on June 30, 2022 that they intend to leave the PAC 12 in time for the 2024 football season, they are in violation of Section 3, and the conference can withhold all payments for their media rights.

If, however, those schools wait until August 2, 2024 and notify the conference that they are leaving immediately, they can do so without any penalty. If the conference has already paid them for the final year they may keep the money, and if they were entitled to receive that final year's distribution as of August 1, 2024 the conference is still obligated to pay them because they are not in violation of Section 3.

So, why would any member give notice ahead of August 2, 2024 unless they intend to leave immediately and their future conference is willing to take them in?

...live (at the time of posting) regarding this topic...

NOTED that AZ, ASU, Utah, and Colorado are reported to meet with the BIG XII Tuesday:

AZ, ASU, UU, UCo meeting Tuesday 6/5/22 with BIGXII?