(08-13-2009 02:05 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:03 PM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:00 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:47 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  I don't think that a Big East #2 with the option to only take ND every other year or every 4 years would trump a Big Ten #4/#5.

I think if they could get the Irish half the time, they would jump at that, and take their chances with Rutgers, UConn or whoever the other half.

but 1x4... I don't think the Gator is feeling it.

Me neither. They, like the Sun Bowl, would rather have a 6-6 Notre Dame than any Big East squad.

and most if not all Big12 bowls would choice ND over any Big12#2 not called Texas

Most B10 bowls would do the same outside OSU, Michigan and PSU.

(08-13-2009 02:05 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:03 PM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:00 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:47 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  I don't think that a Big East #2 with the option to only take ND every other year or every 4 years would trump a Big Ten #4/#5.

I think if they could get the Irish half the time, they would jump at that, and take their chances with Rutgers, UConn or whoever the other half.

but 1x4... I don't think the Gator is feeling it.

Me neither. They, like the Sun Bowl, would rather have a 6-6 Notre Dame than any Big East squad.

and most if not all Big12 bowls would choice ND over any Big12#2 not called Texas

Debatable. The Cotton wouldn't pick a 6-6 ND over a Big XII runner up Oklahoma, Texas A&M or Nebraska. In fact, the Cotton has had the choice to select ND 1 in 4 years recently and they neglected to do so.

(08-13-2009 02:06 PM)SF Husky Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:03 PM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:00 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:47 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  I don't think that a Big East #2 with the option to only take ND every other year or every 4 years would trump a Big Ten #4/#5.

I think if they could get the Irish half the time, they would jump at that, and take their chances with Rutgers, UConn or whoever the other half.

but 1x4... I don't think the Gator is feeling it.

Me neither. They, like the Sun Bowl, would rather have a 6-6 Notre Dame than any Big East squad.

Perception changes over time. UC, UCONN and RU all have proved they can bring fans and travel. UL and WVU also bring a ton of fans. That's 5 BE teams that can bring some fans to a bowl. A FLA bowl is also more attractive than a bowl in Canada or in Alabama. I hope the BE will stand its ground and go after a top tier FLA bowl hard. ND once every 4 years is the only acceptable way.

Well, then Marinatto should show this to be true with the new bowl lineup correct?

So you pick the Cotton in the heart of big12 land. Now let me ask you a question do you think the gator would choose any of those over Notre dame?

(08-13-2009 02:10 PM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:06 PM)SF Husky Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:03 PM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:00 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:47 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  I don't think that a Big East #2 with the option to only take ND every other year or every 4 years would trump a Big Ten #4/#5.

I think if they could get the Irish half the time, they would jump at that, and take their chances with Rutgers, UConn or whoever the other half.

but 1x4... I don't think the Gator is feeling it.

Me neither. They, like the Sun Bowl, would rather have a 6-6 Notre Dame than any Big East squad.

Perception changes over time. UC, UCONN and RU all have proved they can bring fans and travel. UL and WVU also bring a ton of fans. That's 5 BE teams that can bring some fans to a bowl. A FLA bowl is also more attractive than a bowl in Canada or in Alabama. I hope the BE will stand its ground and go after a top tier FLA bowl hard. ND once every 4 years is the only acceptable way.

Well, then Marinatto should show this to be true with the new bowl lineup correct?

I sure hope so.

As for your ND argument, they are pretty much more attractive to bowls than just about any other team in America so the fact some bowls wanting ND is nothing new.

(08-13-2009 01:58 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:49 PM)Tallgrass Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 11:36 AM)KnightLight Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 10:59 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  Ideally, a Florida bowl wants an SEC anchor, and then a Big 10 team, followed by a Big 12 team.

Disagree...especially if its the 5th or 6th placed team in the Big 12.

If the Big East "reforms" into a new football conf...that might give their #2 and even #3 pick more valuable to any FLA Bowl...especially compared to a 4th-6th place team from the Big 12.

Big 12 "lost" the Tangerine/Champs Sports Bowl slot to very bad traveling attendance.

As noted...FLA is basically home to SEC and ACC Bowl Games...with Big East hopefully holding onto a some share (or all of it) of the Gator Bowl...as the Big East can't afford to be stuck with just the St Pete Bowl (unknown future...while Gator Bowl will most certainly be around) in FLA.

Champs was a double hex. First, it was PreXmas. Second, it took a lower ranked conference team where fans are not going to travel hundreds of miles to watch their 7-5 or 6-6 team. I can understand the frustration that happens at times...but let's be honest with the circumstances and situation around the bowls. Every BCS conference tries to put its lower bowls within driving distance.

BINGO!!!!! and thats what im trying to tell you that a Big Ten #5 or Big12 #5 traveling to Jax as an 8-4 or 7-5 team will NOT be a huge draw to the locals and will not be bringing 15k+ to the city.

Northwestern still sent around 15,000 the Alamo Bowl last season in that spot, even though (1) that school has the worst travel reputation in the Big Ten outside of Indiana due to its smaller private school fan base and size and (2) it doesn't have nearly the same alumni base in Texas as it does in Florida. A Big Ten #4 or #5 is going to be an 8-win team at worst - it's virtually always at least a 9-win team in the #4 spot. The larger Big Ten flagships would easily send over 15,000 to the Gator Bowl - you're severely undercounting how well the conference travels top-to-bottom, particularly when taking into account that Big Ten snowbirds live in and travel to Florida in a manner that's a whole lot different than the Big 12.

The gator was all set to take a 7-5 ND team over a better Nebraska team well known for its traveling base.

(08-13-2009 02:15 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:58 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:49 PM)Tallgrass Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 11:36 AM)KnightLight Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 10:59 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  Ideally, a Florida bowl wants an SEC anchor, and then a Big 10 team, followed by a Big 12 team.

Disagree...especially if its the 5th or 6th placed team in the Big 12.

If the Big East "reforms" into a new football conf...that might give their #2 and even #3 pick more valuable to any FLA Bowl...especially compared to a 4th-6th place team from the Big 12.

Big 12 "lost" the Tangerine/Champs Sports Bowl slot to very bad traveling attendance.

As noted...FLA is basically home to SEC and ACC Bowl Games...with Big East hopefully holding onto a some share (or all of it) of the Gator Bowl...as the Big East can't afford to be stuck with just the St Pete Bowl (unknown future...while Gator Bowl will most certainly be around) in FLA.

Champs was a double hex. First, it was PreXmas. Second, it took a lower ranked conference team where fans are not going to travel hundreds of miles to watch their 7-5 or 6-6 team. I can understand the frustration that happens at times...but let's be honest with the circumstances and situation around the bowls. Every BCS conference tries to put its lower bowls within driving distance.

BINGO!!!!! and thats what im trying to tell you that a Big Ten #5 or Big12 #5 traveling to Jax as an 8-4 or 7-5 team will NOT be a huge draw to the locals and will not be bringing 15k+ to the city.

Northwestern still sent around 15,000 the Alamo Bowl last season in that spot, even though (1) that school has the worst travel reputation in the Big Ten outside of Indiana due to its smaller private school fan base and size and (2) it doesn't have nearly the same alumni base in Texas as it does in Florida. A Big Ten #4 or #5 is going to be an 8-win team at worst - it's virtually always at least a 9-win team in the #4 spot. The larger Big Ten flagships would easily send over 15,000 to the Gator Bowl - you're severely undercounting how well the conference travels top-to-bottom, particularly when taking into account that Big Ten snowbirds live in and travel to Florida in a manner that's a whole lot different than the Big 12.

LOL that was the lowest attended Alamo Bowl with 55K so IF NW took 15k then the rest of the city wasnt crazy about it

(08-13-2009 02:16 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  The gator was all set to take a 7-5 ND team over a better Nebraska team well known for its traveling base.

Yeah, and they also had no problem taking a Texas Tech team over instate-USF who had their best season to date in 2007.

(08-13-2009 02:16 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  The gator was all set to take a 7-5 ND team over a better Nebraska team well known for its traveling base.

Nebraska was only 8-4 last year before the bowl game. So they weren't that much better. (are you talking about a different season?)

The comments I have made have been from the standpoint of the bowl games. From the standpoint of the Big East, I think they are absolutely right to insist on their bowl deals including ND only 1x4 years. They should draw a hard line on that point, even if it results in a lower-paying or less-prestigious bowl.

(08-13-2009 02:23 PM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:16 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  The gator was all set to take a 7-5 ND team over a better Nebraska team well known for its traveling base.

Yeah, and they also had no problem taking a Texas Tech team over instate-USF who had their best season to date in 2007.

It is well known Gator has been a bad partner to the BE last few years. Had they taken USF, I have little doubt USF would have sent over 25K to that bowl. Do you think it would be better than the 2K Texas Tech brought over?

I guess they don't care about attendance or TV ratings cause both sucked with B12 team in that game.

If a bowl does not care about either, I guess there is nothing BE can do about that other than to seek new partners.

(08-13-2009 02:23 PM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:16 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  The gator was all set to take a 7-5 ND team over a better Nebraska team well known for its traveling base.

Yeah, and they also had no problem taking a Texas Tech team over instate-USF who had their best season to date in 2007.

LOL. and do you know the reason for it? Because if they had taken USF then the last TWO years would had been Big12 teams which would had meant no shot at ND at all.
By the way how did that turn out? How many did Texas Tech bring?

(08-13-2009 01:45 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:43 PM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:40 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  I agree that a Big East #4 will not be as attractive as BigTen or Big 12 #4. But sorry you are in big denial if you dont realize that a BE#2 with ND one year would trump the Big10 or Big12 #4 deals specially for a Florida bowl.
You are talking about almost guaranteed in a 4 year period to land
1. Notre Dame
2. West Virginia
3. USF ( which would bring large numbers to a Florida bowl vs BCS opponent)
4. Any of the 8 BE schools.

The Gator has this arrangement and it appears that they can't ditch it fast enough. They took Texas Tech (never known for its traveling fan base) over the Big East 2 years ago.

Correct and they got BURNED because Tech brought and drew flies to the gator. You want to compare numbers of the two years of UL,WV vs Nebraska and Tech and youll see the BE was the better deal.

Isn't that the year USF played in the Sun Bowl? USF would've made sense in the Gator and Texas Tech in the Sun. It'd be a no brainer to me because both schools would've brought thousands to a bowl that's only a few hours away if you drive or less than an hour if you fly. Can't understand why the Sun and Gator went the opposite way.

(08-13-2009 02:58 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:45 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:43 PM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:40 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  I agree that a Big East #4 will not be as attractive as BigTen or Big 12 #4. But sorry you are in big denial if you dont realize that a BE#2 with ND one year would trump the Big10 or Big12 #4 deals specially for a Florida bowl.
You are talking about almost guaranteed in a 4 year period to land
1. Notre Dame
2. West Virginia
3. USF ( which would bring large numbers to a Florida bowl vs BCS opponent)
4. Any of the 8 BE schools.

The Gator has this arrangement and it appears that they can't ditch it fast enough. They took Texas Tech (never known for its traveling fan base) over the Big East 2 years ago.

Correct and they got BURNED because Tech brought and drew flies to the gator. You want to compare numbers of the two years of UL,WV vs Nebraska and Tech and youll see the BE was the better deal.

Isn't that the year USF played in the Sun Bowl? USF would've made sense in the Gator and Texas Tech in the Sun. It'd be a no brainer to me because both schools would've brought thousands to a bowl that's only a few hours away if you drive or less than an hour if you fly. Can't understand why the Sun and Gator went the opposite way.

Read my previous post. Had the gator chosen USF then the last two years they would have had to pick Big12 teams with no shot at ND. ND is their #1 goal and theyl choose them this year if the Irish win 7 games

(08-13-2009 02:28 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:23 PM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:16 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  The gator was all set to take a 7-5 ND team over a better Nebraska team well known for its traveling base.

Yeah, and they also had no problem taking a Texas Tech team over instate-USF who had their best season to date in 2007.

LOL. and do you know the reason for it? Because if they had taken USF then the last TWO years would had been Big12 teams which would had meant no shot at ND at all.
By the way how did that turn out? How many did Texas Tech bring?

That's understood, but "perception is reality" for the bowls. The Big Ten and Big 12 have had many years of history sending large numbers of traveling fans to bowls, so the weak Texas Tech showing at the Gator Bowl is thought of as an aberration as opposed to a general rule. The Big 12 is going to get the benefit of the doubt in that situation. The Big East, though, doesn't have that luxury since it has only been in its present form for less than 5 years. USF and UConn weren't even Division 1-A schools until a decade ago - to a bowl committee, Texas Tech still "sounds" like a bigger name even if it's not necessarily fair or accurate when looking at play on the field or attendance in the stands.

The Big East's bowl situation will improve when it develops the brand name schools that give it stability, which doesn't come with just a couple of good years of attendance, but many years of sustaining such attendance. Most of the Big Ten, SEC, and Big 12 schools have had a 50-year head start on most of the Big East schools in terms of earning that travel reputation, so the Big East can't just merely do the same as those other conferences or even point to a year or two where it might have outperformed the others - there has to be a sustained level of performance that goes above and beyond those others for year after year.

As of now, West Virginia is the one Big East school that is a "brand name" from a bowl perspective. Other than that, Syracuse used to be a brand name yet has been terrible for the past several seasons, Rutgers can't just wish away nearly a century of football ineptitude with a couple of recent bowl berths, Pitt generally doesn't have a great bowl travel record, Louisville and Cincinnati are still newcomers to the BCS even though they have made it to top tier bowl games, and UConn and USF are still newcomers to Division 1-A football in general (as mentioned before).

Whether it's fair or not, that's how bowls are going to treat the Big East in contract negotiations. It's not even that the Big East doesn't have a Michigan/Ohio State/Penn State-type program right now - there are only a handful of those types of schools out there. The real problem is that other than WVU, the bowls don't even see a Wisconsin/Michigan State/Purdue/Iowa-type program in the Big East, which aren't in that "most elite of the elite tier" but have long histories of traveling fan support. That's why the Big Ten #4 tie-in is going to get a whole lot of love from the bowls that are still looking for partners.

That is also why the Gator Bowl keeps on insisting on including ND with the Big East #2. I'm not saying that the Big East should take a hybrid deal or like it, but ND is in that "most elite of the elite tier" when it comes to fan bases. I won't blame the Big East for giving up a Gator Bowl berth based on principle for how the conference has been treated, yet you also have to be extremely careful about giving up a tie-in on New Year's Day (which are really the main tie-ins of substantial value outside of the BCS bowls from an exposure perspective). There aren't going to be more New Year's Day bowls created in the near future, so there needs to be caution about ceding such valuable real estate.

(08-13-2009 03:03 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:58 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:45 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:43 PM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:40 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  I agree that a Big East #4 will not be as attractive as BigTen or Big 12 #4. But sorry you are in big denial if you dont realize that a BE#2 with ND one year would trump the Big10 or Big12 #4 deals specially for a Florida bowl.
You are talking about almost guaranteed in a 4 year period to land
1. Notre Dame
2. West Virginia
3. USF ( which would bring large numbers to a Florida bowl vs BCS opponent)
4. Any of the 8 BE schools.

The Gator has this arrangement and it appears that they can't ditch it fast enough. They took Texas Tech (never known for its traveling fan base) over the Big East 2 years ago.

Correct and they got BURNED because Tech brought and drew flies to the gator. You want to compare numbers of the two years of UL,WV vs Nebraska and Tech and youll see the BE was the better deal.

Isn't that the year USF played in the Sun Bowl? USF would've made sense in the Gator and Texas Tech in the Sun. It'd be a no brainer to me because both schools would've brought thousands to a bowl that's only a few hours away if you drive or less than an hour if you fly. Can't understand why the Sun and Gator went the opposite way.

Read my previous post. Had the gator chosen USF then the last two years they would have had to pick Big12 teams with no shot at ND. ND is their #1 goal and theyl choose them this year if the Irish win 7 games

OK. That makes sense, thanks

(08-13-2009 03:03 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:28 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:23 PM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 02:16 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  The gator was all set to take a 7-5 ND team over a better Nebraska team well known for its traveling base.

Yeah, and they also had no problem taking a Texas Tech team over instate-USF who had their best season to date in 2007.

LOL. and do you know the reason for it? Because if they had taken USF then the last TWO years would had been Big12 teams which would had meant no shot at ND at all.
By the way how did that turn out? How many did Texas Tech bring?

That's understood, but "perception is reality" for the bowls. The Big Ten and Big 12 have had many years of history sending large numbers of traveling fans to bowls, so the weak Texas Tech showing at the Gator Bowl is thought of as an aberration as opposed to a general rule. The Big 12 is going to get the benefit of the doubt in that situation. The Big East, though, doesn't have that luxury since it has only been in its present form for less than 5 years. USF and UConn weren't even Division 1-A schools until a decade ago - to a bowl committee, Texas Tech still "sounds" like a bigger name even if it's not necessarily fair or accurate when looking at play on the field or attendance in the stands.

The Big East's bowl situation will improve when it develops the brand name schools that give it stability, which doesn't come with just a couple of good years of attendance, but many years of sustaining such attendance. Most of the Big Ten, SEC, and Big 12 schools have had a 50-year head start on most of the Big East schools in terms of earning that travel reputation, so the Big East can't just merely do the same as those other conferences or even point to a year or two where it might have outperformed the others - there has to be a sustained level of performance that goes above and beyond those others for year after year.

As of now, West Virginia is the one Big East school that is a "brand name" from a bowl perspective. Other than that, Syracuse used to be a brand name yet has been terrible for the past several seasons, Rutgers can't just wish away nearly a century of football ineptitude with a couple of recent bowl berths, Pitt generally doesn't have a great bowl travel record, Louisville and Cincinnati are still newcomers to the BCS even though they have made it to top tier bowl games, and UConn and USF are still newcomers to Division 1-A football in general (as mentioned before).

Whether it's fair or not, that's how bowls are going to treat the Big East in contract negotiations. It's not even that the Big East doesn't have a Michigan/Ohio State/Penn State-type program right now - there are only a handful of those types of schools out there. The real problem is that other than WVU, the bowls don't even see a Wisconsin/Michigan State/Purdue/Iowa-type program in the Big East, which aren't in that "most elite of the elite tier" but have long histories of traveling fan support. That's why the Big Ten #4 tie-in is going to get a whole lot of love from the bowls that are still looking for partners.

That is also why the Gator Bowl keeps on insisting on including ND with the Big East #2. I'm not saying that the Big East should take a hybrid deal or like it, but ND is in that "most elite of the elite tier" when it comes to fan bases. I won't blame the Big East for giving up a Gator Bowl berth based on principle for how the conference has been treated, yet you also have to be extremely careful about giving up a tie-in on New Year's Day (which are really the main tie-ins of substantial value outside of the BCS bowls from an exposure perspective). There aren't going to be more New Year's Day bowls created in the near future, so there needs to be caution about ceding such valuable real estate.

Frank, the fact is UCONN might be new but had years of good traveling fans for basketball. Also, UL brought more fans to the Gator than Va Tech did. Cincy also brought over $17K to the Orange Bowl.

(08-13-2009 02:15 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:58 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 01:49 PM)Tallgrass Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 11:36 AM)KnightLight Wrote:  

(08-13-2009 10:59 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  Ideally, a Florida bowl wants an SEC anchor, and then a Big 10 team, followed by a Big 12 team.

Disagree...especially if its the 5th or 6th placed team in the Big 12.

If the Big East "reforms" into a new football conf...that might give their #2 and even #3 pick more valuable to any FLA Bowl...especially compared to a 4th-6th place team from the Big 12.

Big 12 "lost" the Tangerine/Champs Sports Bowl slot to very bad traveling attendance.

As noted...FLA is basically home to SEC and ACC Bowl Games...with Big East hopefully holding onto a some share (or all of it) of the Gator Bowl...as the Big East can't afford to be stuck with just the St Pete Bowl (unknown future...while Gator Bowl will most certainly be around) in FLA.

Champs was a double hex. First, it was PreXmas. Second, it took a lower ranked conference team where fans are not going to travel hundreds of miles to watch their 7-5 or 6-6 team. I can understand the frustration that happens at times...but let's be honest with the circumstances and situation around the bowls. Every BCS conference tries to put its lower bowls within driving distance.

BINGO!!!!! and thats what im trying to tell you that a Big Ten #5 or Big12 #5 traveling to Jax as an 8-4 or 7-5 team will NOT be a huge draw to the locals and will not be bringing 15k+ to the city.

Northwestern still sent around 15,000 the Alamo Bowl last season in that spot, even though (1) that school has the worst travel reputation in the Big Ten outside of Indiana due to its smaller private school fan base and size and (2) it doesn't have nearly the same alumni base in Texas as it does in Florida. A Big Ten #4 or #5 is going to be an 8-win team at worst - it's virtually always at least a 9-win team in the #4 spot. The larger Big Ten flagships would easily send over 15,000 to the Gator Bowl - you're severely undercounting how well the conference travels top-to-bottom, particularly when taking into account that Big Ten snowbirds live in and travel to Florida in a manner that's a whole lot different than the Big 12.

I was at the game...Northwestern didn't send 15k. Missouri easily brought double the amount that NW did. It was one of the smaller crowds I've seen.

I would guesstimate 8-10k NW fans tops. I was able to sit on the 45 yard line on the NW side and watch the game. San Antonio locals actually support the bowl pretty well.

(08-13-2009 03:19 PM)SF Husky Wrote:  Frank, the fact is UCONN might be new but had years of good traveling fans for basketball. Also, UL brought more fans to the Gator than Va Tech did. Cincy also brought over $17K to the Orange Bowl.

I agree about UConn basketball, but that doesn't really correlate with travel for football (see Indiana and Duke). I know that Louisville and Cincinnati traveled well for their games, but my main point takes that into account, which is that the Big East can't just have a couple of instances of traveling well. Instead, it needs to essentially blow the other conferences out of the water for a decade or more in order to change the bowls' perceptions of the travel ability of the conference. The Big Ten, SEC, and Big 12 schools generally have had long records of traveling to bowls that date back to before the Big East was even founded, so those other conferences are going to be perceived to be safe and stable - that's what the Big East is going up against in these bowl negotiations (not just attendance for the past few years). The bowls are comparing 30, 40, or even 50 years of history of the other conferences compared to 5 years of the current Big East - that gap can eventually be overcome, but it will also take a lot more time than 1 or 2 contract cycles.

(08-13-2009 01:17 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  wrong
Right now even losing Alamo
#2-3 Capital One 4.375 mill
#3-4 Outback 3.2 mill
#4-5 Gator 2.375 mill

So thats where they would be if no oneelse steps up and there are rumors Insight Bowl will increase its pay for bigten.

wrong about what? i said that with the B10 losing the Alamo, the Gator would be a fit for B10 ... ?

And i'm not sure how the Gator is a bad fit for the B10 because of the CapOne? The Outback is played at the virtually the same time as the CapOne and both are SEC/Big 10.